I agree with with it to a certain extent.... But I still believe you can be polite and shit talk someone's score at the same time.
1) I can get 500,000 in tetris
2) That's excellent, I can do you one better good sir, I can get 550,000... But I refuse to show you how I did it.
.... Still shit talking.
Except you're harping about this at people who have posted photo evidence that they have acheived the scores they're talking about.
So they've shown you the "better score", you're just calling their honor into question by saying you think they acheived the score dishonestly, when you KNOW it's a pain in the ass to deal with recording, etc.
Nobody is asking to be named the official world record holder based on photos they've posted.
But they can honestly state that they can beat the official world record, based on those photos, and we should generally believe it.
also, you agreed with me that Pegboy was shit talking.... So where's the beef?
I wasn't referring to the weekly contests for needing video. Nor did I say anything negative about the weekly contests.
Hell, I like me a little shit talking here and there... I've played sports all my life.
And I do trust the ppl in the weekly contests.
There's just very little point saying "I can beat that score" and not proving it. It's just shit talking.... Which is fine, there's just no point to it.
Because you appeared to be calling everybody who's unwiling to go through the TG submission process "shit talkers".
Maybe I misunderstood your original post, but it sure looked like a big blanket statement that encompassed those of us from the contests that have posted about beating world records during the contests.
If you trust the weekly contests, you should have been WAY less generic in your post and just quoted Pegboy in the first place (i.e. the ONLY person shit-talking in the thread -- and not because it fits your goofy shit-talking definition but because it was actually really negatively toned and genuine shit-talking)
There's just very little point saying "I can beat that score" and not proving it. It's just shit talking.... Which is fine, there's just no point to it.
I'll disagree with this statement, though.
It's not hard to imagine a circumstance where a person KNOWS they have beaten a certain score but did not care to take a picture, at the time.
It's also not hard to imagine that SAME person finding themselves in a discussion about high scores, or what level of scoring might be possible in that same game.
So they can VERY REASONABLY state their honest scoring outcome, but not have photo evidence, and not feel the need to go through the effort of getting that evidence by replaying at the time, depending on the context of the conversation.
And that's not "shit talk", by default, unless they build it up to be shit talk through other words and actions.
also, you agreed with me that Pegboy was shit talking.... So where's the beef?
I wasn't referring to the weekly contests for needing video. Nor did I say anything negative about the weekly contests.
Hell, I like me a little shit talking here and there... I've played sports all my life.
And I do trust the ppl in the weekly contests.
There's just very little point saying "I can beat that score" and not proving it. It's just shit talking.... Which is fine, there's just no point to it.
Because you appeared to be calling everybody who's unwiling to go through the TG submission process "shit talkers".
Maybe I misunderstood your original post, but it sure looked like a big blanket statement that encompassed those of us from the contests that have posted about beating world records during the contests.
If you trust the weekly contests, you should have been WAY less generic in your post and just quoted Pegboy in the first place (i.e. the ONLY person shit-talking in the thread -- and not because it fits your goofy shit-talking definition but because it was actually really negatively toned and genuine shit-talking)
okay, well my apologies. I honestly did NOT try to paint the weekly contests as shit talkers. That's the last thing I wanted.
Honestly, I'm sorry if that's how I came across. I respect the hell out of those scores and the organizers/participants.
Im a little embarrassed because my intention was NOT at all to group the weekly players with "shit talkers"
I'm not demanding to see proof.... I'm just pointing out what it is. Trash talking is trash talking....
It's not this big of a thing.
If all you do is TALK, then it's shit talking.
I didn't say ANYTHING about the weekly contests needing more proof or that those involved we're liars.
Wherever it is, whatever the topic. If all you're doing is talking about it, it's shit talking, it's trash talk.
That's all. It's not that complicated nor does there need to be this much heat.
I just completely and fundamentally disagree with your definition and threshold for trash talk or shit talk.
If we're in a thread that isn't a competition... probably all that we're going to do is "talk". Because that's the nature of a thread, or any conversation.
If you're sitting around having beers with your buddies and discussing something, it's totally OK to just talk about something and not have it be "trash talk".
I think we just come from different worlds if that's how you see things.
There's just very little point saying "I can beat that score" and not proving it. It's just shit talking.... Which is fine, there's just no point to it.
I'll disagree with this statement, though.
It's not hard to imagine a circumstance where a person KNOWS they have beaten a certain score but did not care to take a picture, at the time.
It's also not hard to imagine that SAME person finding themselves in a discussion about high scores, or what level of scoring might be possible in that same game.
So they can VERY REASONABLY state their honest scoring outcome, but not have photo evidence, and not feel the need to go through the effort of getting that evidence by replaying at the time, depending on the context of the conversation.
And that's not "shit talk", by default, unless they build it up to be shit talk through other words and actions.
I understand your point but will respectfully disagree.
the unwillingness to provide "proof" means literally that you're ONLY talking.... Thus the term "shit talk"
what if someone went to the weekly contests saying they could beat all the records but didn't show one single score? You'd think they were full of it, right?? Same deal here...
If someone came into the weekly contests and said, "I had the best score," but did not show it, their score would not be reflected on the leader board. Someone saying here, "I have beaten TG records," does not reflect on the TG high scores. I don't see what your issue is. Just let it go. People here are not looking to get on TG's score board. And no one is going to the TG forums to say all this. Why bring your anger on this subject here? You say you're not a paid endorser of TG, but boy it sure seems like it.
I'm not demanding to see proof.... I'm just pointing out what it is. Trash talking is trash talking....
It's not this big of a thing.
If all you do is TALK, then it's shit talking.
I didn't say ANYTHING about the weekly contests needing more proof or that those involved we're liars.
Wherever it is, whatever the topic. If all you're doing is talking about it, it's shit talking, it's trash talk.
That's all. It's not that complicated nor does there need to be this much heat.
I just completely and fundamentally disagree with your definition and threshold for trash talk or shit talk.
If we're in a thread that isn't a competition... probably all that we're going to do is "talk". Because that's the nature of a thread, or any conversation.
If you're sitting around having beers with your buddies and discussing something, it's totally OK to just talk about something and not have it be "trash talk".
I think we just come from different worlds if that's how you see things.
Good point..... I think maybe we are at different ends of the conversation spectrum.
Because I do agree with you... I guess I was looking at it more from s competition side because the OP was talking about TG.
but I can understand where you're coming from just from a CONVERSATIONAL side....
1% battery... Just killed phone with this convo, haha
what if someone went to the weekly contests saying they could beat all the records but didn't show one single score? You'd think they were full of it, right?? Same deal here...
If someone came into the weekly contests and said, "I had the best score," but did not show it, their score would not be reflected on the leader board. Someone saying here, "I have beaten TG records," does not reflect on the TG high scores. I don't see what your issue is. Just let it go. People here are not looking to get on TG's score board. And no one is going to the TG forums to say all this. Why bring your anger on this subject here? You say you're not a paid endorser of TG, but boy it sure seems like it.
This puts it much more succinctly than I managed, thanks
what if someone went to the weekly contests saying they could beat all the records but didn't show one single score? You'd think they were full of it, right?? Same deal here...
If someone came into the weekly contests and said, "I had the best score," but did not show it, their score would not be reflected on the leader board. Someone saying here, "I have beaten TG records," does not reflect on the TG high scores. I don't see what your issue is. Just let it go. People here are not looking to get on TG's score board. And no one is going to the TG forums to say all this. Why bring your anger on this subject here? You say you're not a paid endorser of TG, but boy it sure seems like it.
the point is this... If you can do it, prove it... If you're not willing to prove it, shut up.
Why are we okay with someone trash talking and saying they can beat certain records when they haven't proven anything?
what if someone went to the weekly contests saying they could beat all the records but didn't show one single score? You'd think they were full of it, right?? Same deal here...
It's not the "same deal here". While the weekly contests ask for "proof", that proof extends a great deal of trust, in terms of method of play and honesty of play.
But we still need a photo as a record, and as an extremely low-barrier-to-entry item to weed out liars.
Fully vetted video evidence is a HUGE barrier to entry compared to that, both in terms of equipment required, effort of getting the footage, and time required to review and vet the score.
Nobody is suggesting that you should trust outright what some total random person, of unknown trustworthiness, says, regarding a score or achievement.
What we are generally suggesting, though, is that within a community of people who, to some extent, know each other enough to have established a certain level of mutual respect and trust, it is possible to share these kinds of stories with each other without being told to "shut up and prove it", or in the instance of the weekly contests, photo proof is adequate.
If you want to stay outside of that circle of trust, where we can have those kinds of conversations, and share our gaming war stories, without being called liars or shit talkers, that is your prerogative.
Or, you could change your tune, and realize that those of us who generally post these things, are in fact honest people, speaking frankly and just having a conversation, rather than us asking for a medal of recognition we don't care about
I think maybe you've misunderstood me.
also, you agreed with me that Pegboy was shit talking.... So where's the beef?
I wasn't referring to the weekly contests for needing video. Nor did I say anything negative about the weekly contests.
Hell, I like me a little shit talking here and there... I've played sports all my life.
And I do trust the ppl in the weekly contests.
There's just very little point saying "I can beat that score" and not proving it. It's just shit talking.... Which is fine, there's just no point to it.
You want me to post the fucking videos of my Super Mario Kart times? Because I can, I just didn't see the point because it's not like they are real world record scores or even close to them. But 2 of them are better than the TG records (Rainbow Road and Vanilla Lake 2), and the other 3 are all close to the TG times and I could probably beat them if played it for more than a week.
the point is this... If you can do it, prove it... If you're not willing to prove it, shut up.
Why are we okay with someone trash talking and saying they can beat certain records when they haven't proven anything?
what if someone went to the weekly contests saying they could beat all the records but didn't show one single score? You'd think they were full of it, right?? Same deal here...
It's not the "same deal here". While the weekly contests ask for "proof", that proof extends a great deal of trust, in terms of method of play and honesty of play.
But we still need a photo as a record, and as an extremely low-barrier-to-entry item to weed out liars.
Fully vetted video evidence is a HUGE barrier to entry compared to that, both in terms of equipment required, effort of getting the footage, and time required to review and vet the score.
Nobody is suggesting that you should trust outright what some total random person, of unknown trustworthiness, says, regarding a score or achievement.
What we are generally suggesting, though, is that within a community of people who, to some extent, know each other enough to have established a certain level of mutual respect and trust, it is possible to share these kinds of stories with each other without being told to "shut up and prove it", or in the instance of the weekly contests, photo proof is adequate.
If you want to stay outside of that circle of trust, where we can have those kinds of conversations, and share our gaming war stories, without being called liars or shit talkers, that is your prerogative.
Or, you could change your tune, and realize that those of us who generally post these things, are in fact honest people, speaking frankly and just having a conversation, rather than us asking for a medal of recognition we don't care about
I think maybe you've misunderstood me.
also, you agreed with me that Pegboy was shit talking.... So where's the beef?
I wasn't referring to the weekly contests for needing video. Nor did I say anything negative about the weekly contests.
Hell, I like me a little shit talking here and there... I've played sports all my life.
And I do trust the ppl in the weekly contests.
There's just very little point saying "I can beat that score" and not proving it. It's just shit talking.... Which is fine, there's just no point to it.
You want me to post the fucking videos of my Super Mario Kart times? Because I can, I just didn't see the point because it's not like they are real world record scores or even close to them. But 2 of them are better than the TG records (Rainbow Road and Vanilla Lake 2), and the other 3 are all close to the TG times and I could probably beat them if played it for more than a week.
No need to get all worked up.
If you want to say over and over again about how you can beat those records, why not just post the videos and claim the record for yourself?
I have no doubt that you can beat them. I'm sure a lot of other people here trust you, too. Unfortunately, my opinion doesn't count in the objective eyes of Guiness Book of Records.
Saying and doing are two different things. Until you actually provide videos showing you doing it, to the outside world that's "shit talk", or "trash talking".
No need to get all fired up. This day in age, it's pretty easy to show people your runs, with live online streaming and youtube.
If you don't want to. Fine with me, no beef here. It's just categorically "shit talk"/trash talking, that's all.
To be perfectly clear, this is what I was referring to when I said there was shit talking going on:
Originally posted by: pegboy
What's the point? Most of their "records" are worthless and not even close to the real records. I beat or nearly beat several of the Super Mario Kart times after only playing for a few hours. And that included smashing the Rainbow Road "record" and I was drunk off my ass on 4 glasses of Champagne. The real record for RR is still like 3 seconds faster than mine.
They also invent a bunch of retarded rules and stipulations for certain games to "fix" issues when in reality those games have absolutely meaningless scoring (i.e. Mega Man, Ninja Gaiden and most NES games for that matter). It's pretty much a complete joke as far as I'm concerned.
I don't think there is any definition other than "shit talking" that can be used for this.
So, that's what I was referring to.
I have the utmost respect for the weekly contests, and was NEVER attempting to say that everyone who participated was shit talking. That's not even close to how I feel.
I actually think it would be AWESOME if NA members had lots of records. Why would that be bad?
The barrier to entry is minimal... it's pretty easy to sign up and submit scores. TG isn't all that bad. Sure, the management is a little off here and there, but it's still cool to be able to compare your scores with others (on the same playing field) with EVERYONE in the world.
And above all that, The Guinness Book of Records Gamer's Edition uses them as their official record/score keepers.
There's always hositililty towards TG and their "crappy" records, maybe it's ONLY from pegboy, but I don't think it necessarily has to be so harsh.
NA is awesome and so is TG. Why can't that be a thing?
what if someone went to the weekly contests saying they could beat all the records but didn't show one single score? You'd think they were full of it, right?? Same deal here...
If someone came into the weekly contests and said, "I had the best score," but did not show it, their score would not be reflected on the leader board. Someone saying here, "I have beaten TG records," does not reflect on the TG high scores. I don't see what your issue is. Just let it go. People here are not looking to get on TG's score board. And no one is going to the TG forums to say all this. Why bring your anger on this subject here? You say you're not a paid endorser of TG, but boy it sure seems like it.
There's no anger coming from my end. There was a lot of hostility and condescending language in the reply to the OP's post. Read the first reply to the thread, which I just quoted.
I understand what you're saying and you make a good point.
But, Pegboy compares the records, I don't. When people compare them (and put them down), I say "Just post your own if yours can beat them." What's wrong with that? When people here say they can beat "their" records, why not just go post them there too?
There's no one on the TG boards anymore to talk about anything anyways, haha...
If TG is good enough for rdrunner, who is a somewhat active member here and one of the greatest record holders at TG, then it's good enough for me.
So I should send in my "records" to Twin Galaxies so I can have a fake world record on their website? I know my scores aren't world records, so why should I pretend like they are by plastering them all over twin galaxies phony website?
If they merely advertised the scores posted on there as "community" records or "The Twin Galaxy record" or something of that sort I'd have much less of a problem with them. But the fact that they pretend to be the ultimate authority on video game scores and claim "WORLD RECORD" about everything on there is just ridiculous and I'm not going to play pretend along with them. If it's a farce, I'm going to call it as such.
So I should send in my "records" to Twin Galaxies so I can have a fake world record on their website? I know my scores aren't world records, so why should I pretend like they are by plastering them all over twin galaxies phony website?
If they merely advertised the scores posted on there as "community" records or "The Twin Galaxy record" or something of that sort I'd have much less of a problem with them. But the fact that they pretend to be the ultimate authority on video game scores and claim "WORLD RECORD" about everything on there is just ridiculous and I'm not going to play pretend along with them. If it's a farce, I'm going to call it as such.
You can do whatever you want with your scores, man.
Here's the thing:
The OP asked a simple question.
You, without any knowledge and no practical experience, decided to NOT answer the question in a condescending and derogatory way.
Saying that the "records are worthless and not even close to the real records." is erroneous and inaccurate.
Do you really think they ALL are terrible? Do you know all of the records Twin Galaxies has on the NES? Can you beat all of them easily?
Can you beat ALL those records? Are they all worthless?
Sure, the "world record" thing is silly... but Guinness recognizes it, so why wouldn't TG run with it? And, all the games have standardized rules and regulations, so you are literally putting yourself on the same playing field as the rest of the world.
Sure, the "world record" thing is silly... but Guinness recognizes it, so why wouldn't TG run with it? And, all the games have standardized rules and regulations, so you are literally putting yourself on the same playing field as the rest of the world.
Guinness is clueless when it comes to video games (and a lot of other records). The fact that they would partner with TG proves it. Pegboy can be abrasive, but in this thread he's absolutely right. TG has always been a horrible organization for anything but early 80s arcade scores.
Sure, the "world record" thing is silly... but Guinness recognizes it, so why wouldn't TG run with it? And, all the games have standardized rules and regulations, so you are literally putting yourself on the same playing field as the rest of the world.
Guinness is clueless when it comes to video games (and a lot of other records). The fact that they would partner with TG proves it. Pegboy can be abrasive, but in this thread he's absolutely right. TG has always been a horrible organization for anything but early 80s arcade scores.
I'm just saying... we don't need pitchforks and torches everytime someone brings up TG scores.
Twin Galaxies isn't near as bad as people say it is. And I wonder how many of those people have ever actually tried using the site or joined the "community".
Like, I said, I don't fully support TG in everything they do.
But to crap on the scores saying they're "worthless" all the time is false and far from the truth.
Sure, with hundreds of records, some are going to be low and some are going to be VERY beatable. Well, that's the whole point... if you can beat it, do it.
When I first saw the score for Skate or Die 2, I knew I could beat it. So instead of just typing words in an online forum, I decided to go through the process, beat the record, and send in my video.
The scores have to start somewhere.
I don't quite understand why everyone says TG is so horrible. Honestly... why? It's really no where near as bad as people say it is. Just a bunch of negative hype.
Sure, there's not much of a community there anymore, but it's not nearly as crappy as everyone always says.
And it makes absolutley zero sense to crap all over the scores when it's 2 simple steps to PROVING you are better.
1) Play.
2) Post.
You know the saying "You talk the talk, but can you walk the walk?"
I just perused the Weekly contests (again, as I keep an eye on the action somewhat) and I have to say... I would get absolutely obliterated by the scores. They are awesome, and props to those players.
I could post a decent score on Battletoads (max out) but can't come close to beating it.
I'd also like to point out that it wasn't me who brought up the comparison in the first place. I believe both sets of scores to be awesome in their own right.
If anyone beat my Skate or Die ramp record I would be hella surprised. And I wouldn't accept it as fact unless I saw the video.
Saying that people here beat the record, with only a screenshot as proof, doesn't mean anything.
Are you Brad Costa (24,755 score)?
If it is so, I don't really get how you would be surprised to see someone beating your score. With that score you obviously didn't performed the best possible tricks on the left side of the ramp. You can't expect having an unbeatable score without first getting an almost perfect run.
And yes, I beat your score several times but I don't have any better proof for you right now than a picture
If anyone beat my Skate or Die ramp record I would be hella surprised. And I wouldn't accept it as fact unless I saw the video.
Saying that people here beat the record, with only a screenshot as proof, doesn't mean anything.
Are you Brad Costa (24,755 score)?
If it is so, I don't really get how you would be surprised to see someone beating your score. With that score you obviously didn't performed the best possible tricks on the left side of the ramp. You can't expect having an unbeatable score without first getting an almost perfect run.
And yes, I beat your score several times but I don't have any better proof for you right now than a picture
Mine is for Skate or Die 2: Ramp Mode, I wasn't very clear before, my bad. 220,241 points. The video is on YouTube.
Just for the record... I would trust someone like you, guillavoie, that beat my record and showed me a picture, and certainly trust you'd play within the rules. As I trust the scores in the weekly contest with pictures as well.
Just, it makes sense to want to see an entire playthrough to see HOW a score/time is reached, that's all.
I KNOW it's possible to beat my record because I fell off my first board in the first couple jumps, haha. And I didn't get my GF out. And I didn't get ANY board bonuses at the end.
I figure a perfect run would be around 300,000... so it's a beatable "record" for sure.
Originally posted by: pegboy
World records are meant to be broken.
Yeah, exactly.
That's why I even submitted any scores in the first place... because I knew I could beat them. There were some notable members of the site that submitted records for games with no scores just to get competition started. Some of those really low scores still stand because some games go unnoticed for whatever reason.
Doesn't mean it's the absolute highest score possible... just that it's the highest score sent to them. Talk to Walter Day and Guinness if you have a problem with them calling them "World Records".
I think calling them "world records" is pretty funny as well. I laugh about it with my brother all the time. I even bought my own "TG Record Holder" shirt, haha. But still... if Guinness is going to publish a book and the TG records are the ones they use for games... then that's pretty solid.
Like I've said before, some of the scores are pretty crappy and easily beatable.
Others are absolutely amazing and untouchable (as, in my eyes, alot of rdrunner's scores are).
If anyone beat my Skate or Die ramp record I would be hella surprised. And I wouldn't accept it as fact unless I saw the video.
Saying that people here beat the record, with only a screenshot as proof, doesn't mean anything.
Are you Brad Costa (24,755 score)?
If it is so, I don't really get how you would be surprised to see someone beating your score. With that score you obviously didn't performed the best possible tricks on the left side of the ramp. You can't expect having an unbeatable score without first getting an almost perfect run.
And yes, I beat your score several times but I don't have any better proof for you right now than a picture
Mine is for Skate or Die 2: Ramp Mode, I wasn't very clear before, my bad. 220,241 points. The video is on YouTube.
Just for the record... I would trust someone like you, guillavoie, that beat my record and showed me a picture, and certainly trust you'd play within the rules. As I trust the scores in the weekly contest with pictures as well.
Just, it makes sense to want to see an entire playthrough to see HOW a score/time is reached, that's all.
I KNOW it's possible to beat my record because I fell off my first board in the first couple jumps, haha. And I didn't get my GF out. And I didn't get ANY board bonuses at the end.
I figure a perfect run would be around 300,000... so it's a beatable "record" for sure.
Haha!
Yeah, Skate or Die 2 is a totally different case, I'm not too familiar with it but your run looks to be quite good
And you are basically right, a world record needs to be on video, that's mandatory. A lot of them are more than beatable so I'm inclined to trust people that can show a picture and explain what they did etc. It depends on the game too, for example records for SMB are unreal compared to less popular games.
I like TG for having a point to shoot for, at least on games that you can tell more than 3 people gave a shot at. I've never submitted, until about 3 months ago I never had a way to record myself playing.
I completely agree that the best scores from around the world aren't reflected on that website, so truly saying they are world records is probably a stretch.
I didn't really know they were still even kicking, I guess that's something, would love to take some shots at some scores again, we used to get pretty amped up in the contests about trying to beat those.
Comments
Politeness aside..... Those are the same thing.
That being said, arch, I understand your point.
I agree with with it to a certain extent.... But I still believe you can be polite and shit talk someone's score at the same time.
1) I can get 500,000 in tetris
2) That's excellent, I can do you one better good sir, I can get 550,000... But I refuse to show you how I did it.
.... Still shit talking.
Except you're harping about this at people who have posted photo evidence that they have acheived the scores they're talking about.
So they've shown you the "better score", you're just calling their honor into question by saying you think they acheived the score dishonestly, when you KNOW it's a pain in the ass to deal with recording, etc.
Nobody is asking to be named the official world record holder based on photos they've posted.
But they can honestly state that they can beat the official world record, based on those photos, and we should generally believe it.
I think maybe you've misunderstood me.
also, you agreed with me that Pegboy was shit talking.... So where's the beef?
I wasn't referring to the weekly contests for needing video. Nor did I say anything negative about the weekly contests.
Hell, I like me a little shit talking here and there... I've played sports all my life.
And I do trust the ppl in the weekly contests.
There's just very little point saying "I can beat that score" and not proving it. It's just shit talking.... Which is fine, there's just no point to it.
Because you appeared to be calling everybody who's unwiling to go through the TG submission process "shit talkers".
Maybe I misunderstood your original post, but it sure looked like a big blanket statement that encompassed those of us from the contests that have posted about beating world records during the contests.
If you trust the weekly contests, you should have been WAY less generic in your post and just quoted Pegboy in the first place (i.e. the ONLY person shit-talking in the thread -- and not because it fits your goofy shit-talking definition but because it was actually really negatively toned and genuine shit-talking)
It's not this big of a thing.
If all you do is TALK, then it's shit talking.
I didn't say ANYTHING about the weekly contests needing more proof or that those involved we're liars.
Wherever it is, whatever the topic. If all you're doing is talking about it, it's shit talking, it's trash talk.
That's all. It's not that complicated nor does there need to be this much heat.
There's just very little point saying "I can beat that score" and not proving it. It's just shit talking.... Which is fine, there's just no point to it.
I'll disagree with this statement, though.
It's not hard to imagine a circumstance where a person KNOWS they have beaten a certain score but did not care to take a picture, at the time.
It's also not hard to imagine that SAME person finding themselves in a discussion about high scores, or what level of scoring might be possible in that same game.
So they can VERY REASONABLY state their honest scoring outcome, but not have photo evidence, and not feel the need to go through the effort of getting that evidence by replaying at the time, depending on the context of the conversation.
And that's not "shit talk", by default, unless they build it up to be shit talk through other words and actions.
I think maybe you've misunderstood me.
also, you agreed with me that Pegboy was shit talking.... So where's the beef?
I wasn't referring to the weekly contests for needing video. Nor did I say anything negative about the weekly contests.
Hell, I like me a little shit talking here and there... I've played sports all my life.
And I do trust the ppl in the weekly contests.
There's just very little point saying "I can beat that score" and not proving it. It's just shit talking.... Which is fine, there's just no point to it.
Because you appeared to be calling everybody who's unwiling to go through the TG submission process "shit talkers".
Maybe I misunderstood your original post, but it sure looked like a big blanket statement that encompassed those of us from the contests that have posted about beating world records during the contests.
If you trust the weekly contests, you should have been WAY less generic in your post and just quoted Pegboy in the first place (i.e. the ONLY person shit-talking in the thread -- and not because it fits your goofy shit-talking definition but because it was actually really negatively toned and genuine shit-talking)
okay, well my apologies. I honestly did NOT try to paint the weekly contests as shit talkers. That's the last thing I wanted.
Honestly, I'm sorry if that's how I came across. I respect the hell out of those scores and the organizers/participants.
Im a little embarrassed because my intention was NOT at all to group the weekly players with "shit talkers"
I'm not demanding to see proof.... I'm just pointing out what it is. Trash talking is trash talking....
It's not this big of a thing.
If all you do is TALK, then it's shit talking.
I didn't say ANYTHING about the weekly contests needing more proof or that those involved we're liars.
Wherever it is, whatever the topic. If all you're doing is talking about it, it's shit talking, it's trash talk.
That's all. It's not that complicated nor does there need to be this much heat.
I just completely and fundamentally disagree with your definition and threshold for trash talk or shit talk.
If we're in a thread that isn't a competition... probably all that we're going to do is "talk". Because that's the nature of a thread, or any conversation.
If you're sitting around having beers with your buddies and discussing something, it's totally OK to just talk about something and not have it be "trash talk".
I think we just come from different worlds if that's how you see things.
There's just very little point saying "I can beat that score" and not proving it. It's just shit talking.... Which is fine, there's just no point to it.
I'll disagree with this statement, though.
It's not hard to imagine a circumstance where a person KNOWS they have beaten a certain score but did not care to take a picture, at the time.
It's also not hard to imagine that SAME person finding themselves in a discussion about high scores, or what level of scoring might be possible in that same game.
So they can VERY REASONABLY state their honest scoring outcome, but not have photo evidence, and not feel the need to go through the effort of getting that evidence by replaying at the time, depending on the context of the conversation.
And that's not "shit talk", by default, unless they build it up to be shit talk through other words and actions.
I understand your point but will respectfully disagree.
the unwillingness to provide "proof" means literally that you're ONLY talking.... Thus the term "shit talk"
what if someone went to the weekly contests saying they could beat all the records but didn't show one single score? You'd think they were full of it, right?? Same deal here...
If someone came into the weekly contests and said, "I had the best score," but did not show it, their score would not be reflected on the leader board. Someone saying here, "I have beaten TG records," does not reflect on the TG high scores. I don't see what your issue is. Just let it go. People here are not looking to get on TG's score board. And no one is going to the TG forums to say all this. Why bring your anger on this subject here? You say you're not a paid endorser of TG, but boy it sure seems like it.
I'm not demanding to see proof.... I'm just pointing out what it is. Trash talking is trash talking....
It's not this big of a thing.
If all you do is TALK, then it's shit talking.
I didn't say ANYTHING about the weekly contests needing more proof or that those involved we're liars.
Wherever it is, whatever the topic. If all you're doing is talking about it, it's shit talking, it's trash talk.
That's all. It's not that complicated nor does there need to be this much heat.
I just completely and fundamentally disagree with your definition and threshold for trash talk or shit talk.
If we're in a thread that isn't a competition... probably all that we're going to do is "talk". Because that's the nature of a thread, or any conversation.
If you're sitting around having beers with your buddies and discussing something, it's totally OK to just talk about something and not have it be "trash talk".
I think we just come from different worlds if that's how you see things.
Good point..... I think maybe we are at different ends of the conversation spectrum.
Because I do agree with you... I guess I was looking at it more from s competition side because the OP was talking about TG.
but I can understand where you're coming from just from a CONVERSATIONAL side....
1% battery... Just killed phone with this convo, haha
what if someone went to the weekly contests saying they could beat all the records but didn't show one single score? You'd think they were full of it, right?? Same deal here...
If someone came into the weekly contests and said, "I had the best score," but did not show it, their score would not be reflected on the leader board. Someone saying here, "I have beaten TG records," does not reflect on the TG high scores. I don't see what your issue is. Just let it go. People here are not looking to get on TG's score board. And no one is going to the TG forums to say all this. Why bring your anger on this subject here? You say you're not a paid endorser of TG, but boy it sure seems like it.
This puts it much more succinctly than I managed, thanks
what if someone went to the weekly contests saying they could beat all the records but didn't show one single score? You'd think they were full of it, right?? Same deal here...
If someone came into the weekly contests and said, "I had the best score," but did not show it, their score would not be reflected on the leader board. Someone saying here, "I have beaten TG records," does not reflect on the TG high scores. I don't see what your issue is. Just let it go. People here are not looking to get on TG's score board. And no one is going to the TG forums to say all this. Why bring your anger on this subject here? You say you're not a paid endorser of TG, but boy it sure seems like it.
There's no anger here
come on guys
come on guys
that rug really tied the room together.
the point is this... If you can do it, prove it... If you're not willing to prove it, shut up.
Why are we okay with someone trash talking and saying they can beat certain records when they haven't proven anything?
what if someone went to the weekly contests saying they could beat all the records but didn't show one single score? You'd think they were full of it, right?? Same deal here...
It's not the "same deal here". While the weekly contests ask for "proof", that proof extends a great deal of trust, in terms of method of play and honesty of play.
But we still need a photo as a record, and as an extremely low-barrier-to-entry item to weed out liars.
Fully vetted video evidence is a HUGE barrier to entry compared to that, both in terms of equipment required, effort of getting the footage, and time required to review and vet the score.
Nobody is suggesting that you should trust outright what some total random person, of unknown trustworthiness, says, regarding a score or achievement.
What we are generally suggesting, though, is that within a community of people who, to some extent, know each other enough to have established a certain level of mutual respect and trust, it is possible to share these kinds of stories with each other without being told to "shut up and prove it", or in the instance of the weekly contests, photo proof is adequate.
If you want to stay outside of that circle of trust, where we can have those kinds of conversations, and share our gaming war stories, without being called liars or shit talkers, that is your prerogative.
Or, you could change your tune, and realize that those of us who generally post these things, are in fact honest people, speaking frankly and just having a conversation, rather than us asking for a medal of recognition we don't care about
I think maybe you've misunderstood me.
also, you agreed with me that Pegboy was shit talking.... So where's the beef?
I wasn't referring to the weekly contests for needing video. Nor did I say anything negative about the weekly contests.
Hell, I like me a little shit talking here and there... I've played sports all my life.
And I do trust the ppl in the weekly contests.
There's just very little point saying "I can beat that score" and not proving it. It's just shit talking.... Which is fine, there's just no point to it.
You want me to post the fucking videos of my Super Mario Kart times? Because I can, I just didn't see the point because it's not like they are real world record scores or even close to them. But 2 of them are better than the TG records (Rainbow Road and Vanilla Lake 2), and the other 3 are all close to the TG times and I could probably beat them if played it for more than a week.
the point is this... If you can do it, prove it... If you're not willing to prove it, shut up.
Why are we okay with someone trash talking and saying they can beat certain records when they haven't proven anything?
what if someone went to the weekly contests saying they could beat all the records but didn't show one single score? You'd think they were full of it, right?? Same deal here...
It's not the "same deal here". While the weekly contests ask for "proof", that proof extends a great deal of trust, in terms of method of play and honesty of play.
But we still need a photo as a record, and as an extremely low-barrier-to-entry item to weed out liars.
Fully vetted video evidence is a HUGE barrier to entry compared to that, both in terms of equipment required, effort of getting the footage, and time required to review and vet the score.
Nobody is suggesting that you should trust outright what some total random person, of unknown trustworthiness, says, regarding a score or achievement.
What we are generally suggesting, though, is that within a community of people who, to some extent, know each other enough to have established a certain level of mutual respect and trust, it is possible to share these kinds of stories with each other without being told to "shut up and prove it", or in the instance of the weekly contests, photo proof is adequate.
If you want to stay outside of that circle of trust, where we can have those kinds of conversations, and share our gaming war stories, without being called liars or shit talkers, that is your prerogative.
Or, you could change your tune, and realize that those of us who generally post these things, are in fact honest people, speaking frankly and just having a conversation, rather than us asking for a medal of recognition we don't care about
I think maybe you've misunderstood me.
also, you agreed with me that Pegboy was shit talking.... So where's the beef?
I wasn't referring to the weekly contests for needing video. Nor did I say anything negative about the weekly contests.
Hell, I like me a little shit talking here and there... I've played sports all my life.
And I do trust the ppl in the weekly contests.
There's just very little point saying "I can beat that score" and not proving it. It's just shit talking.... Which is fine, there's just no point to it.
You want me to post the fucking videos of my Super Mario Kart times? Because I can, I just didn't see the point because it's not like they are real world record scores or even close to them. But 2 of them are better than the TG records (Rainbow Road and Vanilla Lake 2), and the other 3 are all close to the TG times and I could probably beat them if played it for more than a week.
No need to get all worked up.
If you want to say over and over again about how you can beat those records, why not just post the videos and claim the record for yourself?
I have no doubt that you can beat them. I'm sure a lot of other people here trust you, too. Unfortunately, my opinion doesn't count in the objective eyes of Guiness Book of Records.
Saying and doing are two different things. Until you actually provide videos showing you doing it, to the outside world that's "shit talk", or "trash talking".
No need to get all fired up. This day in age, it's pretty easy to show people your runs, with live online streaming and youtube.
If you don't want to. Fine with me, no beef here. It's just categorically "shit talk"/trash talking, that's all.
What's the point? Most of their "records" are worthless and not even close to the real records. I beat or nearly beat several of the Super Mario Kart times after only playing for a few hours. And that included smashing the Rainbow Road "record" and I was drunk off my ass on 4 glasses of Champagne. The real record for RR is still like 3 seconds faster than mine.
They also invent a bunch of retarded rules and stipulations for certain games to "fix" issues when in reality those games have absolutely meaningless scoring (i.e. Mega Man, Ninja Gaiden and most NES games for that matter). It's pretty much a complete joke as far as I'm concerned.
I don't think there is any definition other than "shit talking" that can be used for this.
So, that's what I was referring to.
I have the utmost respect for the weekly contests, and was NEVER attempting to say that everyone who participated was shit talking. That's not even close to how I feel.
I actually think it would be AWESOME if NA members had lots of records. Why would that be bad?
The barrier to entry is minimal... it's pretty easy to sign up and submit scores. TG isn't all that bad. Sure, the management is a little off here and there, but it's still cool to be able to compare your scores with others (on the same playing field) with EVERYONE in the world.
And above all that, The Guinness Book of Records Gamer's Edition uses them as their official record/score keepers.
There's always hositililty towards TG and their "crappy" records, maybe it's ONLY from pegboy, but I don't think it necessarily has to be so harsh.
NA is awesome and so is TG. Why can't that be a thing?
what if someone went to the weekly contests saying they could beat all the records but didn't show one single score? You'd think they were full of it, right?? Same deal here...
If someone came into the weekly contests and said, "I had the best score," but did not show it, their score would not be reflected on the leader board. Someone saying here, "I have beaten TG records," does not reflect on the TG high scores. I don't see what your issue is. Just let it go. People here are not looking to get on TG's score board. And no one is going to the TG forums to say all this. Why bring your anger on this subject here? You say you're not a paid endorser of TG, but boy it sure seems like it.
There's no anger coming from my end. There was a lot of hostility and condescending language in the reply to the OP's post. Read the first reply to the thread, which I just quoted.
I understand what you're saying and you make a good point.
But, Pegboy compares the records, I don't. When people compare them (and put them down), I say "Just post your own if yours can beat them." What's wrong with that? When people here say they can beat "their" records, why not just go post them there too?
There's no one on the TG boards anymore to talk about anything anyways, haha...
If TG is good enough for rdrunner, who is a somewhat active member here and one of the greatest record holders at TG, then it's good enough for me.
If they merely advertised the scores posted on there as "community" records or "The Twin Galaxy record" or something of that sort I'd have much less of a problem with them. But the fact that they pretend to be the ultimate authority on video game scores and claim "WORLD RECORD" about everything on there is just ridiculous and I'm not going to play pretend along with them. If it's a farce, I'm going to call it as such.
So I should send in my "records" to Twin Galaxies so I can have a fake world record on their website? I know my scores aren't world records, so why should I pretend like they are by plastering them all over twin galaxies phony website?
If they merely advertised the scores posted on there as "community" records or "The Twin Galaxy record" or something of that sort I'd have much less of a problem with them. But the fact that they pretend to be the ultimate authority on video game scores and claim "WORLD RECORD" about everything on there is just ridiculous and I'm not going to play pretend along with them. If it's a farce, I'm going to call it as such.
You can do whatever you want with your scores, man.
Here's the thing:
The OP asked a simple question.
You, without any knowledge and no practical experience, decided to NOT answer the question in a condescending and derogatory way.
Saying that the "records are worthless and not even close to the real records." is erroneous and inaccurate.
Do you really think they ALL are terrible? Do you know all of the records Twin Galaxies has on the NES? Can you beat all of them easily?
http://www.twingalaxies.com/scores.php?player=31312
Can you beat ALL those records? Are they all worthless?
Sure, the "world record" thing is silly... but Guinness recognizes it, so why wouldn't TG run with it? And, all the games have standardized rules and regulations, so you are literally putting yourself on the same playing field as the rest of the world.
If you can beat their scores, do it.
To answer the OP's question AGAIN:
It's pretty easy, and fun, to submit scores.
My bad.
Sure, the "world record" thing is silly... but Guinness recognizes it, so why wouldn't TG run with it? And, all the games have standardized rules and regulations, so you are literally putting yourself on the same playing field as the rest of the world.
Guinness is clueless when it comes to video games (and a lot of other records). The fact that they would partner with TG proves it. Pegboy can be abrasive, but in this thread he's absolutely right. TG has always been a horrible organization for anything but early 80s arcade scores.
Sure, the "world record" thing is silly... but Guinness recognizes it, so why wouldn't TG run with it? And, all the games have standardized rules and regulations, so you are literally putting yourself on the same playing field as the rest of the world.
Guinness is clueless when it comes to video games (and a lot of other records). The fact that they would partner with TG proves it. Pegboy can be abrasive, but in this thread he's absolutely right. TG has always been a horrible organization for anything but early 80s arcade scores.
I'm just saying... we don't need pitchforks and torches everytime someone brings up TG scores.
Twin Galaxies isn't near as bad as people say it is. And I wonder how many of those people have ever actually tried using the site or joined the "community".
Like, I said, I don't fully support TG in everything they do.
But to crap on the scores saying they're "worthless" all the time is false and far from the truth.
Sure, with hundreds of records, some are going to be low and some are going to be VERY beatable. Well, that's the whole point... if you can beat it, do it.
When I first saw the score for Skate or Die 2, I knew I could beat it. So instead of just typing words in an online forum, I decided to go through the process, beat the record, and send in my video.
The scores have to start somewhere.
I don't quite understand why everyone says TG is so horrible. Honestly... why? It's really no where near as bad as people say it is. Just a bunch of negative hype.
Sure, there's not much of a community there anymore, but it's not nearly as crappy as everyone always says.
And it makes absolutley zero sense to crap all over the scores when it's 2 simple steps to PROVING you are better.
1) Play.
2) Post.
You know the saying "You talk the talk, but can you walk the walk?"
That.
I could post a decent score on Battletoads (max out) but can't come close to beating it.
I'd also like to point out that it wasn't me who brought up the comparison in the first place. I believe both sets of scores to be awesome in their own right.
Originally posted by: AirVillain
If anyone beat my Skate or Die ramp record I would be hella surprised. And I wouldn't accept it as fact unless I saw the video.
Saying that people here beat the record, with only a screenshot as proof, doesn't mean anything.
Are you Brad Costa (24,755 score)?
If it is so, I don't really get how you would be surprised to see someone beating your score. With that score you obviously didn't performed the best possible tricks on the left side of the ramp. You can't expect having an unbeatable score without first getting an almost perfect run.
And yes, I beat your score several times but I don't have any better proof for you right now than a picture
http://i57.tinypic.com/1zxr2f8.jpg
Originally posted by: guillavoie
Originally posted by: AirVillain
If anyone beat my Skate or Die ramp record I would be hella surprised. And I wouldn't accept it as fact unless I saw the video.
Saying that people here beat the record, with only a screenshot as proof, doesn't mean anything.
Are you Brad Costa (24,755 score)?
If it is so, I don't really get how you would be surprised to see someone beating your score. With that score you obviously didn't performed the best possible tricks on the left side of the ramp. You can't expect having an unbeatable score without first getting an almost perfect run.
And yes, I beat your score several times but I don't have any better proof for you right now than a picture
http://i57.tinypic.com/1zxr2f8.jp...
You got me!
Haha, just kidding. I'm not Brad Costa.
Mine is for Skate or Die 2: Ramp Mode, I wasn't very clear before, my bad. 220,241 points. The video is on YouTube.
Just for the record... I would trust someone like you, guillavoie, that beat my record and showed me a picture, and certainly trust you'd play within the rules. As I trust the scores in the weekly contest with pictures as well.
Just, it makes sense to want to see an entire playthrough to see HOW a score/time is reached, that's all.
I KNOW it's possible to beat my record because I fell off my first board in the first couple jumps, haha. And I didn't get my GF out. And I didn't get ANY board bonuses at the end.
I figure a perfect run would be around 300,000... so it's a beatable "record" for sure.
Originally posted by: pegboy
World records are meant to be broken.
Yeah, exactly.
That's why I even submitted any scores in the first place... because I knew I could beat them. There were some notable members of the site that submitted records for games with no scores just to get competition started. Some of those really low scores still stand because some games go unnoticed for whatever reason.
Doesn't mean it's the absolute highest score possible... just that it's the highest score sent to them. Talk to Walter Day and Guinness if you have a problem with them calling them "World Records".
I think calling them "world records" is pretty funny as well. I laugh about it with my brother all the time. I even bought my own "TG Record Holder" shirt, haha. But still... if Guinness is going to publish a book and the TG records are the ones they use for games... then that's pretty solid.
Like I've said before, some of the scores are pretty crappy and easily beatable.
Others are absolutely amazing and untouchable (as, in my eyes, alot of rdrunner's scores are).
Originally posted by: AirVillain
Originally posted by: guillavoie
Originally posted by: AirVillain
If anyone beat my Skate or Die ramp record I would be hella surprised. And I wouldn't accept it as fact unless I saw the video.
Saying that people here beat the record, with only a screenshot as proof, doesn't mean anything.
Are you Brad Costa (24,755 score)?
If it is so, I don't really get how you would be surprised to see someone beating your score. With that score you obviously didn't performed the best possible tricks on the left side of the ramp. You can't expect having an unbeatable score without first getting an almost perfect run.
And yes, I beat your score several times but I don't have any better proof for you right now than a picture
http://i57.tinypic.com/1zxr2f8.jpg
You got me!
Haha, just kidding. I'm not Brad Costa.
Mine is for Skate or Die 2: Ramp Mode, I wasn't very clear before, my bad. 220,241 points. The video is on YouTube.
Just for the record... I would trust someone like you, guillavoie, that beat my record and showed me a picture, and certainly trust you'd play within the rules. As I trust the scores in the weekly contest with pictures as well.
Just, it makes sense to want to see an entire playthrough to see HOW a score/time is reached, that's all.
I KNOW it's possible to beat my record because I fell off my first board in the first couple jumps, haha. And I didn't get my GF out. And I didn't get ANY board bonuses at the end.
I figure a perfect run would be around 300,000... so it's a beatable "record" for sure.
Haha!
Yeah, Skate or Die 2 is a totally different case, I'm not too familiar with it but your run looks to be quite good
And you are basically right, a world record needs to be on video, that's mandatory. A lot of them are more than beatable so I'm inclined to trust people that can show a picture and explain what they did etc. It depends on the game too, for example records for SMB are unreal compared to less popular games.
I completely agree that the best scores from around the world aren't reflected on that website, so truly saying they are world records is probably a stretch.
I didn't really know they were still even kicking, I guess that's something, would love to take some shots at some scores again, we used to get pretty amped up in the contests about trying to beat those.