Is collecting going to reach a cap at some point?

I'm not trying to make this a bubble burst thread... just curious if/when there will ever be a cap on the rarest of games. It would make sense that any game released in this day and age will never be as sought after or go as much as the rare NES carts or even some SNES. I just sold a CIB SNES game for a very high amount of money and am curious if there will be a point where people will refuse to pay a certain amount for a game regardless of rarity etc. Hell, I wasn't even that interested to sell, but it was one of those offers that was too good to refuse. Not that I'll ever regret selling, but it got me thinking, will this game be worth significantly more in 20 years or will it be roughly the same with the biggest increase already far behind us.



I know there has been talk about the latest NWC that popped up and SE seemly cooling a bit from its previous sales, so are these beginning to cap? Will the games that now go for $1000+ eventually climb above $5000? $10000? What do you think SE or NWC will be worth in 10, 30, or 50 years from now?


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Comments

  • What goes up, must come down  
  • Nah. It's not like with cars where they're timeless. Games for systems like the NES will mostly appeal to those that were around when it was the latest and greatest.
  • Prices will always fluctuate, so they can't be capped. They could peak and drop off but that doesn't mean they would not peak again.
  • We're gonna land these game prices on the moon! Then at least something would have landed there  
  • My question is: What future system will not be expensive to collect for? Like will we have a system that the rarest game has like 10,000 copies and is not hard to find? I guess only time will tell.
  • Nope prices are going to soar now thanks to this thread.
  • Originally posted by: BiggerBluer



    My question is: What future system will not be expensive to collect for? Like will we have a system that the rarest game has like 10,000 copies and is not hard to find? I guess only time will tell.

    My bet would be on Xbox 360, but I'm not sure about the 10,000 figure.
  • Originally posted by: Andy_Bogomil



    I'm not trying to make this a bubble burst thread... just curious if/when there will ever be a cap on the rarest of games. It would make sense that any game released in this day and age will never be as sought after or go as much as the rare NES carts or even some SNES. I just sold a CIB SNES game for a very high amount of money and am curious if there will be a point where people will refuse to pay a certain amount for a game regardless of rarity etc. Hell, I wasn't even that interested to sell, but it was one of those offers that was too good to refuse. Not that I'll ever regret selling, but it got me thinking, will this game be worth significantly more in 20 years or will it be roughly the same with the biggest increase already far behind us.



    I know there has been talk about the latest NWC that popped up and SE seemly cooling a bit from its previous sales, so are these beginning to cap? Will the games that now go for $1000+ eventually climb above $5000? $10000? What do you think SE or NWC will be worth in 10, 30, or 50 years from now?

     



    Price caps are only in one's mind.  



    Barry Beck was one of the biggest early comic collectors and his thought in the 70s was that Action 1, detective 27 etc could never be worth "more than a good reliable used car" because at that price point "real life" things can be done with the money.



    Well, there is no cap, Barry.   Those comics soared past the cost of a used car because the buyers became people who did not need cars.    Prices depend on two things:  supply and demand.   Nothing else.   Now the mind has a natural tendency to want to benchmark and its for that reason that people lose their shit over new prices.



    But the benchmarks are constructs in your mind and not reflective of the market because new buyers enter the market with no such preconstructed benchmarks.



    They are a blank slate and the new guy will cheerily pay what to the old guy seems like an outrageous price.
  • Originally posted by: Alder

     
    Originally posted by: BiggerBluer



    My question is: What future system will not be expensive to collect for? Like will we have a system that the rarest game has like 10,000 copies and is not hard to find? I guess only time will tell.

    My bet would be on Xbox 360, but I'm not sure about the 10,000 figure.

    I was thinking the same as well. I was just guesing on the number but I would like to hope that in the future we wont have consoles that have only 200 or so production runs of games.



     
  • The problem with the more recent consoles is that a lot of low production number shovelware is often released.
  • inflation + time x desire + hype(squared) = expensive
  • haahaha
  • Originally posted by: Bronty

     
    Originally posted by: Andy_Bogomil



    I'm not trying to make this a bubble burst thread... just curious if/when there will ever be a cap on the rarest of games. It would make sense that any game released in this day and age will never be as sought after or go as much as the rare NES carts or even some SNES. I just sold a CIB SNES game for a very high amount of money and am curious if there will be a point where people will refuse to pay a certain amount for a game regardless of rarity etc. Hell, I wasn't even that interested to sell, but it was one of those offers that was too good to refuse. Not that I'll ever regret selling, but it got me thinking, will this game be worth significantly more in 20 years or will it be roughly the same with the biggest increase already far behind us.



    I know there has been talk about the latest NWC that popped up and SE seemly cooling a bit from its previous sales, so are these beginning to cap? Will the games that now go for $1000+ eventually climb above $5000? $10000? What do you think SE or NWC will be worth in 10, 30, or 50 years from now?

     



    Price caps are only in one's mind.  



    Barry Beck was one of the biggest early comic collectors and his thought in the 70s was that Action 1, detective 27 etc could never be worth "more than a good reliable used car" because at that price point "real life" things can be done with the money.



    Well, there is no cap, Barry.   Those comics soared past the cost of a used car because the buyers became people who did not need cars.    Prices depend on two things:  supply and demand.   Nothing else.   Now the mind has a natural tendency to want to benchmark and its for that reason that people lose their shit over new prices.



    But the benchmarks are constructs in your mind and not reflective of the market because new buyers enter the market with no such preconstructed benchmarks.



    They are a blank slate and the new guy will cheerily pay what to the old guy seems like an outrageous price.





    So you think the same will apply to video games? Comic books are quite a bit older. I agree that caps are relative to each person, but is there a point where it just becomes unrealistic for everyone except the very few who have infinite money? What do you think a CIB SE would be worth in 50 years?
  • Originally posted by: Andy_Bogomil

     
    Originally posted by: Bronty

     
    Originally posted by: Andy_Bogomil



    I'm not trying to make this a bubble burst thread... just curious if/when there will ever be a cap on the rarest of games. It would make sense that any game released in this day and age will never be as sought after or go as much as the rare NES carts or even some SNES. I just sold a CIB SNES game for a very high amount of money and am curious if there will be a point where people will refuse to pay a certain amount for a game regardless of rarity etc. Hell, I wasn't even that interested to sell, but it was one of those offers that was too good to refuse. Not that I'll ever regret selling, but it got me thinking, will this game be worth significantly more in 20 years or will it be roughly the same with the biggest increase already far behind us.



    I know there has been talk about the latest NWC that popped up and SE seemly cooling a bit from its previous sales, so are these beginning to cap? Will the games that now go for $1000+ eventually climb above $5000? $10000? What do you think SE or NWC will be worth in 10, 30, or 50 years from now?

     



    Price caps are only in one's mind.  



    Barry Beck was one of the biggest early comic collectors and his thought in the 70s was that Action 1, detective 27 etc could never be worth "more than a good reliable used car" because at that price point "real life" things can be done with the money.



    Well, there is no cap, Barry.   Those comics soared past the cost of a used car because the buyers became people who did not need cars.    Prices depend on two things:  supply and demand.   Nothing else.   Now the mind has a natural tendency to want to benchmark and its for that reason that people lose their shit over new prices.



    But the benchmarks are constructs in your mind and not reflective of the market because new buyers enter the market with no such preconstructed benchmarks.



    They are a blank slate and the new guy will cheerily pay what to the old guy seems like an outrageous price.





    So you think the same will apply to video games? Comic books are quite a bit older. I agree that caps are relative to each person, but is there a point where it just becomes unrealistic for everyone except the very few who have infinite money? What do you think a CIB SE would be worth in 50 years?



    I'm not making predictions necessarily, I'm just saying anything is possible if people continue to want the stuff.   50 years out is just way too long for me to even guess though  

     
  • Originally posted by: Bronty

     
    Originally posted by: Andy_Bogomil



    I'm not trying to make this a bubble burst thread... just curious if/when there will ever be a cap on the rarest of games. It would make sense that any game released in this day and age will never be as sought after or go as much as the rare NES carts or even some SNES. I just sold a CIB SNES game for a very high amount of money and am curious if there will be a point where people will refuse to pay a certain amount for a game regardless of rarity etc. Hell, I wasn't even that interested to sell, but it was one of those offers that was too good to refuse. Not that I'll ever regret selling, but it got me thinking, will this game be worth significantly more in 20 years or will it be roughly the same with the biggest increase already far behind us.



    I know there has been talk about the latest NWC that popped up and SE seemly cooling a bit from its previous sales, so are these beginning to cap? Will the games that now go for $1000+ eventually climb above $5000? $10000? What do you think SE or NWC will be worth in 10, 30, or 50 years from now?

     



    Price caps are only in one's mind.  



    Barry Beck was one of the biggest early comic collectors and his thought in the 70s was that Action 1, detective 27 etc could never be worth "more than a good reliable used car" because at that price point "real life" things can be done with the money.



    Well, there is no cap, Barry.   Those comics soared past the cost of a used car because the buyers became people who did not need cars.    Prices depend on two things:  supply and demand.   Nothing else.   Now the mind has a natural tendency to want to benchmark and its for that reason that people lose their shit over new prices.



    But the benchmarks are constructs in your mind and not reflective of the market because new buyers enter the market with no such preconstructed benchmarks.



    They are a blank slate and the new guy will cheerily pay what to the old guy seems like an outrageous price.



    the comic book guy had a decent idea. but if there is only 500 se carts and 30,000 people want one and out of the 30,000 that want one 1,000 of them are so rich they dont know what physical money looks like... 29,000 people wont even be close to being able to pay what the 1,000 fighting for one will be willing to.... is that even a real thing or did i just make that up? 
  • you're exactly right on that.   And the numbers don't have to be so large!   Same result if ten make it to market a year, and 12 guys with money want one every year.



    im actually kinda surprised the hobby doesn't have any guys that are rich rich as of now.    There are well off guys but the wall st hedge fund manager or the stinking rich (9 figure net worth) businessman who is a real collector ?   Don't see em.    As high as those numbers are, other hobbies have those guys.   Maybe there needs to be more expensive stuff to buy for those guys to even bother
  • What I've been wondering is how repros and emulation will affect the market. Repros add an element of risk and are gradually flooding the market- will that make rarer titles all the more valuable? Or will it drive potential buyers away in disgust, shrinking the market? Will emulation interest newcomers in the hobby, or will it make them indifferent, since they can play pretty much everything on a laptop?



    Then again, digital comics and trade paperbacks hardly destroyed vintage comics, and most pirates were never going to pay for the authentic experience anyway.
  • Originally posted by: Bronty

    you're exactly right on that.   And the numbers don't have to be so large!   Same result if ten make it to market a year, and 12 guys with money want one every year.



    im actually kinda surprised the hobby doesn't have any guys that are rich rich as of now.    There are well off guys but the wall st hedge fund manager or the stinking rich (9 figure net worth) businessman who is a real collector ?   Don't see em.    As high as those numbers are, other hobbies have those guys.   Maybe there needs to be more expensive stuff to buy for those guys to even bother





    Only one i know of is the guy that founded occulus. Hes a bajillionare collector.
  • Fools, these prices will never stop rising. Hurry we must buy up everything so we can live like kings.
  • I don't think there will, necessarily, ever be a cap on the really rare titles. Games like Stadium Events, NWC, Little Samson, etc... will always be worth money and likely increase in price, to those top-tier collectors. But, I do think we're gonna start hitting the ceiling on a lot of other titles. Just for example, take a few moderately priced games, something like Sunset Riders, Turtles in Time, King of Dragons, Knights of the Round, etc... Think about those $50-$100 dollar titles... I don't ever see those games being $200+ dollar titles. Eventually, things are going to peak. I think we're already kind of seeing it. Eventually, people our ages are going to finish collecting or decide they don't care anymore. And yes, there will always be interest in retro games, but it just can't possibly keep going higher, at least not the majority of games. Video games are nothing like baseball cards, comics, classic cars, etc... Wall street bankers and high rollers are usually spending big money on stuff like that. None of them are out trying to gobble up video game libraries, hoping that the value increases times ten.



    It's similar to something like vinyl. There was a huge boom in vinyl, 10-15 years ago because all of the people who grew up with it wanted their collections back. A lot of records which actually sold a lot of copies and had plenty of them manufactured were selling for pretty decent money, despite being extremely common. Now, you can walk into any vinyl store and buy 90% of their titles for a fraction of what they were selling for 10+ years ago, unless it's something really, really rare. Of course, there are still people interested in vinyl, but like any hobby, when the age range of people who grew up with it start to finish their collections, get their fix, or get out of collecting and decide they don't care anymore, prices stabilize and or drop a bit. I'm not psychic, so I can't say what's going to happen with video games, but I can't see it rising and staying hot forever. Same thing happened with baseball cards and comics. They were huge through the 60's, 70's and most of the 80's, so then, a lot of people gobbled up comics and baseball cards all through the 90's and then those markets just crashed. And now days, those hobbies aren't anything like they were 20-30+ years ago. Sure, there's still interest, but nothing like there used to be.



    I only see video games sliding down, other than those ultra-rare titles. Especially, as we move further with technology. A majority of people would rather emulate or own games on the virtual consoles or buy crap like the NES mini and such. People like us at NintendoAge are the minority. Most people aren't keeping multiple retro consoles around with a CRT or Framemeister for HDTVs. And even if Joe Six-Pack decides to get ambitious and hook his old consoles up to his HDTV, he's probably going to decide it looks like complete ass and will probably just go the emulation route anyway. So will games and the hobby always hold value to us and the community here? Of course. But, there's still plenty of casuals and tourists out there buying retro because it's hot right now and that's keeping prices steady. Give it a few years and those suckers will get weeded out and the fire will die down a bit. I'm, by no means, saying everything is gonna come crashing down and we'll be buying 99 cent NES carts again. But, it's not gonna ride this high wave forever. It's just not. No market does.
  • Looks like it's this time of the week again! Who's in the mood for some Bubble Bobble?  
  • I think Too beaucoup's post above nails it. You have already seen a lot of games stabilize in price. I think sites like pricecharting and GVN are helping because people have more data available for prices. "Average price of Dracula X is $180, forget this eBay auction, I'm not paying $220", and so on.



    Also people will lose interest like anything else. Truly rare games will hold value because there are enough of us that will stick around for a while and still want those games.
  • I don't have time to elaborate but I have also noticed the power shift. The power shift is real and it is happening now.



    What used to happen:

    Rare titles went through droughts, were listed higher and higher at increasing BINs and typically bought. Prices climbed. There was legitimate pent up demand for many titles.



    What is happening now:

    Rare titles are sitting at BINs and stagnating. People aren't buying them, they are waiting for auctions. You can find practically any game you want available somewhere... for the right price. The sheer fact of it being available cause people to lose interest and not believe something is as rare people say it is.



    I'm not speculating on price but I do think that supply has caught up to demand for the most part. There's a lot of people who want to be sellers now at current values and some of these buyers may be left with hot potatoes....
  • As NES fans get older and start dying off from accidents and health problems, demand will eventually weaken and value will start to drop. Then it might slowly start climbing as more young people become interested just for the sake of collectability (like people who collect antiques older than they are).
  • Dunno. Atari games are what I like to use as an example.

    The rare games are still expensive, and rightfully so, but most others aren't worth that much anymore.

    I don't collect NES or SNES or keep up with their prices, so what would I know..?
  • Originally posted by: Bronty

     
    Originally posted by: Andy_Bogomil



    I'm not trying to make this a bubble burst thread... just curious if/when there will ever be a cap on the rarest of games. It would make sense that any game released in this day and age will never be as sought after or go as much as the rare NES carts or even some SNES. I just sold a CIB SNES game for a very high amount of money and am curious if there will be a point where people will refuse to pay a certain amount for a game regardless of rarity etc. Hell, I wasn't even that interested to sell, but it was one of those offers that was too good to refuse. Not that I'll ever regret selling, but it got me thinking, will this game be worth significantly more in 20 years or will it be roughly the same with the biggest increase already far behind us.



    I know there has been talk about the latest NWC that popped up and SE seemly cooling a bit from its previous sales, so are these beginning to cap? Will the games that now go for $1000+ eventually climb above $5000? $10000? What do you think SE or NWC will be worth in 10, 30, or 50 years from now?

     



    Price caps are only in one's mind.  



    Barry Beck was one of the biggest early comic collectors and his thought in the 70s was that Action 1, detective 27 etc could never be worth "more than a good reliable used car" because at that price point "real life" things can be done with the money.



    Well, there is no cap, Barry.   Those comics soared past the cost of a used car because the buyers became people who did not need cars.    Prices depend on two things:  supply and demand.   Nothing else.   Now the mind has a natural tendency to want to benchmark and its for that reason that people lose their shit over new prices.



    But the benchmarks are constructs in your mind and not reflective of the market because new buyers enter the market with no such preconstructed benchmarks.



    They are a blank slate and the new guy will cheerily pay what to the old guy seems like an outrageous price.





    This
  • Greedy resellers that think they have gold are the one's driving the market up, but it's the buyers who keep paying the prices keeping it where it's at. Unfortunately, nobody wants to miss out on buying that rare game when they see it at ebay average prices in fear they'll never find it again at that price or lower, so they bite and keep the market price going upward. It's a vicious cycle that won't stop unless demand and interest drops off significantly. In my opinion, the heavy hitters of NES have more or less peaked, SNES is just about peaked (Hagane and Aerofighters don't seem to be moving up), but the N64 is still ballooning.



    The prices for N64 games is a good example here. The prices have ballooned up ridiculous in the last 2 years, with $50 CIB titles now being hundreds. Look at Worms Armageddon, Clay Fighter Sculptor's Cut, and even Rat Attack for a good example (Rat Attack is still relatively cheap cart only at $20~, but it's well over $100 CIB now). The market keeps going up because people are getting newly interested in the scene, and feel that if they don't scoop the game they desire at the price they see now, that they'll never find it that cheap again. I'm uncomfortable with it, but I know that the prices I've paid accumulating my SNES collection on a lot of games would be considered outrageous to some, but I also collected quite a bit in the mid 2000s so I do know what they once were (and what I paid for a good amount of them too).
  • Originally posted by: Morakaton



    The prices for N64 games is a good example here. The prices have ballooned up ridiculous in the last 2 years, with $50 CIB titles now being hundreds. Look at Worms Armageddon, Clay Fighter Sculptor's Cut, and even Rat Attack for a good example (Rat Attack is still relatively cheap cart only at $20~, but it's well over $100 CIB now). The market keeps going up because people are getting newly interested in the scene, and feel that if they don't scoop the game they desire at the price they see now, that they'll never find it that cheap again. I'm uncomfortable with it, but I know that the prices I've paid accumulating my SNES collection on a lot of games would be considered outrageous to some, but I also collected quite a bit in the mid 2000s so I do know what they once were (and what I paid for a good amount of them too).

    Not to get too OT, but even N64 already had their rapid growth period... maybe 2012-2014 is when some titles really started tripling overnight. 



    Rat Attack for example, it was a $25-$50 CIB / Sealed title up until about 2011-2012.  I noticed it was in a drought so I tried to flipped my dupe CIB for a high price and it did go for $279.99 on 6-16-13, looks like it is still the highest recorded sale on Pricecharting actually...



    https://www.pricecharting.com/game/nintendo-64/rat-attack#completed-auctions-cib



    Now what you see as rapid growth from $75-$200 is really still under the highs this game set 3 years ago.  Personally feels like that game is meant to be around $100-$150 IMO, depending on condition and if poster is included.



    Anyways, this does all tie back to the initial point of the thread.  The rapid growth periods for ALL of the retro systems are already behind us.  Maybe a title here or there balloons up on a Youtube hype video but that's it.  From here on out you expect slow growth at best, tapering off at worst.  The rarest of the rare may be exceptions but everything else will follow the trend.
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