NES (Nt mini) horizontal bars?
I'm pulling my hair out because I can't remember if these have always been there, but I noticed some horizontal bars during games now. Best way I can describe them is dim stripes. They're not scan lines (duh), but instead black bars that are on the screen and pretty much go away only when I turn off scan lines.
My current settings are 4x by 5x, Original scan lines at 78 depth.
Here are some pics (they're very hard to capture):
https://i.imgur.com/29K2Xvl.jpg (scan line depth turned very high to exaggerate the depth and make it easier to capture)
https://i.imgur.com/GRkhvFu.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/9FYPzjA.jpg
They show up with either ROMs or carts. Are they just normal and I'm not getting enough sleep and being super weird?
My current settings are 4x by 5x, Original scan lines at 78 depth.
Here are some pics (they're very hard to capture):
https://i.imgur.com/29K2Xvl.jpg (scan line depth turned very high to exaggerate the depth and make it easier to capture)
https://i.imgur.com/GRkhvFu.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/9FYPzjA.jpg
They show up with either ROMs or carts. Are they just normal and I'm not getting enough sleep and being super weird?
Comments
I'm pulling my hair out because I can't remember if these have always been there, but I noticed some horizontal bars during games now. Best way I can describe them is dim stripes. They're not scan lines (duh), but instead black bars that are on the screen and pretty much go away only when I turn off scan lines.
My current settings are 4x by 5x, Original scan lines at 78 depth.
Here are some pics (they're very hard to capture):
https://i.imgur.com/29K2Xvl.jpg... (scan line depth turned very high to exaggerate the depth and make it easier to capture)
https://i.imgur.com/GRkhvFu.jpg...
https://i.imgur.com/9FYPzjA.jpg...
They show up with either ROMs or carts. Are they just normal and I'm not getting enough sleep and being super weird?
If you take a picture close enough to see the actual pixels of your TV's panel, you'll see that the scanlines are unequal thickness. Your TV is probably zooming the picture slightly to simulate the overscan of an old CRT, but that defeats your integer scale.
1. What is the TV's exact model?
2. What output resolution is the Nt mini using? (720p? 1080p?)
1. Samsung UN43J5200AFXZA
2. 1080p
That should disable the simulated overscan and it will stop the slight zoom on your screen.
Have you ever seen something like that before? I have no idea what they're called so I had a hard time finding something like that on Google; that and they're hard to photograph.
They appear only when I switch to 4x by 5x and turn on scan lines. 5x by 6x is my main setting so that's why I never noticed before.
Edit:
This page shows what I'm seeing:
https://forums.libretro.com/t/crt-shaders-and-vertical-games/11644.
That second image is what's showing up for me, albeit horizontal.
Changed it to Screen Fit and the problem went away! That's weird. Next TV will be 4k.
Most 4K TVs have 2,160 rows of pixels. For the 4K TV, you'll probably want to set 720p output.
240 * 3 = 720
720 * 3 = 2160
With scanlines disabled, each row of NES pixels would occupy 9 rows of pixels on the TV's panel. That also assumes the TV lets you disable simulated overscan like the "screen fit" mode on your current TV. Some TVs don't have a proper option and some make it extremely unintuitive.
If it seems like the TV's image processor is still doing something funny on a 4K TV, then I'd try 1080p output to see if it bypasses some of the TV's image processing.
Isn't 1080 a 2x integer scale on a 4k TV?
Yes, but 240 doesn't fit cleanly in 1080 with an integer multiple.
240 x 4.5 = 1080
I guess if I turn scanlines on with the 4k TV if have to fiddle with the settings to see what looks right? There's no setting I should keep in mind?
Isn't 1080 a 2x integer scale on a 4k TV?
Yes, but 240 doesn't fit cleanly in 1080 with an integer multiple.
240 x 4.5 = 1080
But using 5x height by 6x width (in 1080p output mode) is an integer multiple and has advantages over the alternatives:
1. A Larger output image with only top and bottom 5% cropped (which would have been part of overscan on a CRT anyway)
2. A 1.2x pixel aspect ratio, wihch looks significantly better IMO than the 1.33 pixel aspect that is forced by integer scaled 720p
3. For 1080p the TV doesn't have to process the signal at all (reducing lag), and on a 4k TV it's possible that upscaling from 1080p is more efficient than 720p
Isn't 1080 a 2x integer scale on a 4k TV?
Yes, but 240 doesn't fit cleanly in 1080 with an integer multiple.
240 x 4.5 = 1080
But using 5x height by 6x width (in 1080p output mode) is an integer multiple and has advantages over the alternatives:
1. A Larger output image with only top and bottom 5% cropped (which would have been part of overscan on a CRT anyway)
2. A 1.2x pixel aspect ratio, wihch looks significantly better IMO than the 1.33 pixel aspect that is forced by integer scaled 720p
3. For 1080p the TV doesn't have to process the signal at all (reducing lag), and on a 4k TV it's possible that upscaling from 1080p is more efficient than 720p
Does Nt mini support 5x? I was under the impression it has the same limitations as Hi-Def NES -- which does not have a 5x mode. Kevtris has said it's not possible to add a cropped 5x mode to the Hi-Def NES with the FPGA it has, but maybe it's possible with Nt mini...?
Isn't 1080 a 2x integer scale on a 4k TV?
Yes, but 240 doesn't fit cleanly in 1080 with an integer multiple.
240 x 4.5 = 1080
But using 5x height by 6x width (in 1080p output mode) is an integer multiple and has advantages over the alternatives:
1. A Larger output image with only top and bottom 5% cropped (which would have been part of overscan on a CRT anyway)
2. A 1.2x pixel aspect ratio, wihch looks significantly better IMO than the 1.33 pixel aspect that is forced by integer scaled 720p
3. For 1080p the TV doesn't have to process the signal at all (reducing lag), and on a 4k TV it's possible that upscaling from 1080p is more efficient than 720p
Does Nt mini support 5x? I was under the impression it has the same limitations as Hi-Def NES -- which does not have a 5x mode. Kevtris has said it's not possible to add a cropped 5x mode to the Hi-Def NES with the FPGA it has, but maybe it's possible with Nt mini...?
Yep, kevtris was able to add 5x scaling on the Nt Mini due to the larger FPGA. The Super Nt will have it as well.