For those who collect unlicensed, what do you find appealing about it?
I suppose this is another one of those you can file under my "curiosiries of collecting" category 
....
Certain carts here: Cheetahmen, Panesians, etc. Seem to draw huge interest and people treating them like they're the equivilent of SE or NWC. I guess I'm curious about everyone's opinion on why that is, particularly those that collect them.
My opinion on them is that they are not official and thus while they may be rare they have no significance as they aren't actually part of the collection. Now I could understand for someone that has the full licensed set how there may be some interest in getting new games, and when you can get the Camerica games for the same price as a regular NES cart that's cool cause it's just another cheap game to play, but when someones spending in the range of $500-$1000 for a game that isn't even part of the collection that's a little strange to me, especially given that since they are unlicensed (in theory) some new company could come along and start making more. So does this mean that if someone makes a homebrew and only makes 20 copies it's now worth $1000?
Even though I have an impossibly hard time justifying the purchase, if I had to spend $1500 on SE someday because it was the last game I was missing, and I was in a position to do so I probably would because it would complete my collection. Even though it doesn't count towards the complete set, I understand the appeal of NWC because it is an official game, and I get it's significance to Nintendo fans so even though I wouldn't spend that kind of money on it I do see why it fetches the $ it does.
So this ones for you...if you collect unlicensed, why are these games worth it to you?
Comments
The flaw in your argument is that you believe that the unlicensed games aren't part of a "complete" collection. I believe that they are. Ergo, the justification for unlicensed games is exatly the same as licensed ones.
You are arguing a matter of opinion.
Edit: Ross beat me to it.
The flaw in your argument is that you believe that the unlicensed games aren't part of a "complete" collection. I believe that they are. Ergo, the justification for unlicensed games is exatly the same as licensed ones.
You are arguing a matter of opinion.
Edit: Ross beat me to it.
If you are collecting "Nintendo" games though, then by defninition wouldn't you only be collecting things that bear the seal of approval? I honestly don't think that way as I own some homebrews and a Game Genie, but I also feel like if those all went away I'd still have a "complete" collection based on that I'd have all the officially licensed NES games.
EDIT: and another thing...asides from the complete/non-complete argument. What are everyone's thoughts on the going prices of these games in light of the fact they aren't Nintendo licensed?
My opinion on what makes an unlicensed set is all NTSC carts that were unlicensed and sold in American stores. So my complete set would exclude the Sachen games. Some consider them unlicensed where others consider them pirates.
That being said, I never plan to get the super huge games (myriad, panesians, and cheetahmen II). They simply aren't worth it for me. I really like buying/collecting/owning the original carts, but there's a limit so where possible I'll take the cheaper alternative to the super rares (ie Pirate Booty instead of the Panesians) or just go without them.
If you are collecting "Nintendo" games though, then by defninition wouldn't you only be collecting things that bear the seal of approval?
Then must you include the licensed PAL only carts? They weren't available for sale in the USA, but the unlicensed carts were. Without those you don't have all the carts with the seal.
If you are collecting "Nintendo" games though, then by defninition wouldn't you only be collecting things that bear the seal of approval?
Then must you include the licensed PAL only carts? They weren't available for sale in the USA, but the unlicensed carts were. Without those you don't have all the carts with the seal.
unless all youare going for is NTSC
The flaw in your argument is that you believe that the unlicensed games aren't part of a "complete" collection. I believe that they are. Ergo, the justification for unlicensed games is exatly the same as licensed ones.
You are arguing a matter of opinion.
Edit: Ross beat me to it.
If you are collecting "Nintendo" games though, then by defninition wouldn't you only be collecting things that bear the seal of approval? I honestly don't think that way as I own some homebrews and a Game Genie, but I also feel like if those all went away I'd still have a "complete" collection based on that I'd have all the officially licensed NES games.
EDIT: and another thing...asides from the complete/non-complete argument. What are everyone's thoughts on the going prices of these games in light of the fact they aren't Nintendo licensed?
Please. You're just trying to justify being lazy and not picking up the extra games.
The flaw in your argument is that you believe that the unlicensed games aren't part of a "complete" collection. I believe that they are. Ergo, the justification for unlicensed games is exatly the same as licensed ones.
You are arguing a matter of opinion.
Edit: Ross beat me to it.
If you are collecting "Nintendo" games though, then by defninition wouldn't you only be collecting things that bear the seal of approval? I honestly don't think that way as I own some homebrews and a Game Genie, but I also feel like if those all went away I'd still have a "complete" collection based on that I'd have all the officially licensed NES games.
EDIT: and another thing...asides from the complete/non-complete argument. What are everyone's thoughts on the going prices of these games in light of the fact they aren't Nintendo licensed?
Please. You're just trying to justify being lazy and not picking up the extra games.
LOL. I'm not sure if that's the reason why...
However, Ross brought up a great analogy. If you collect Hockey, Football, Basketball, Baseball, etc. it doesn't mean you collect stuff from the NHL, NFL, NBA, or MLB respectively. Licensed games WERE SOLD in stores and were available. They were even sued, and Nintendo lost the lawsuit (at least against Tengen), therefore making them NES games. They work on the NES and were mass produced, right? There you go. They are NES games.
The flaw in your argument is that you believe that the unlicensed games aren't part of a "complete" collection. I believe that they are. Ergo, the justification for unlicensed games is exatly the same as licensed ones.
You are arguing a matter of opinion.
Edit: Ross beat me to it.
If you are collecting "Nintendo" games though, then by defninition wouldn't you only be collecting things that bear the seal of approval? I honestly don't think that way as I own some homebrews and a Game Genie, but I also feel like if those all went away I'd still have a "complete" collection based on that I'd have all the officially licensed NES games.
EDIT: and another thing...asides from the complete/non-complete argument. What are everyone's thoughts on the going prices of these games in light of the fact they aren't Nintendo licensed?
I think you're just jelous cause you don't have any.
Also I do have every intention of collecting the PAL only NES games...just need to finish up the NTSC first before I start that quest.
My opinion on what makes an unlicensed set is all NTSC carts that were unlicensed and sold in American stores.
So would you stop at including just the Tengen games? I consider the unlicensed Tengen games as part of my own "widely available" set definition. I would not include any other unlicensed games in that category since:
Just about every major retailer was illegally required by Nintendo NOT to carry unlicensed games. When I walked into a Toys R Us, Kay Bee, Kiddie City, etc., I would never find unlicensed games on the shelves. Electronic Boutique in the mall may have had some, but I do not remember for certain. Either way, no kids I knew had even heard of unlicensed games (besides Tengen), save for the odd pirated game you'd find at a rental place.
For the record I'm definitely not jealous, I'm more than happy never owning porn NES games haha.
But you must be pumped to own all the Fisher Price, Barbie, and Sesame Street games, right?
I know the Panesian games are no Dance Aerobics, but they're better than some games out there.
I like being able to play games released for the NES. Any game, all games, and do so legally. That's part of the reason I have a complete Licensed set and close to finishing my Unlicensed set. Of course, I bought a bunch of the crap games just to have them all, and I can pick up any of them and try them out if I wish.
There are some really fun unlicensed games as well, and some of us are players and collectors. If you limit yourself to a certain company, you can miss out on a bunch of fun titles.
My opinion on what makes an unlicensed set is all NTSC carts that were unlicensed and sold in American stores.
So would you stop at including just the Tengen games? I consider the unlicensed Tengen games as part of my own "widely available" set definition. I would not include any other unlicensed games in that category since:
Just about every major retailer was illegally required by Nintendo NOT to carry unlicensed games. When I walked into a Toys R Us, Kay Bee, Kiddie City, etc., I would never find unlicensed games on the shelves. Electronic Boutique in the mall may have had some, but I do not remember for certain. Either way, no kids I knew had even heard of unlicensed games (besides Tengen), save for the odd pirated game you'd find at a rental place.
No I wouldn't stop at the Tengen games. I would include all the unlicensed games ( Cheetahman II is debatable) that are on the 1997 Mike Etlers list.
I believe that the unlicensed games on the Etler list were found in stores at some point. Now maybe not all of them were available in your area, maybe not in any of the large chain stores, but sold somewhere for them to get sold to the public. That is why I said sold in American stores.
Just my stupid opinion. I don't know much about the NES anyway.
Oh and I like your vids Pat
Like MasonSushi, I've always collected games that were on Mike Etler's list. Most people who started collecting back in the day used that list. And now, even though there is better lists out there (like this site), that list is still in the backs of the minds of the old collectors - who usually have a big influence on what people consider a "Complete" collection.
when that list first came out. It made my collecting a lot easier. I consider it the definitive list to have a complete set. Licensed and unlicensed.
New games I consider homebrews and sachens I consider pirates. The ones where people use Japanese boards with a converter ( ie , Gyromite) i consider to be conversions and the ones where people take the roms and translate them, I consider them to be a rom hack/ Translation cart.
All well and good, and all import to the NES community. Just not part of a "complete" set.
Just my opinion though.
Like MasonSushi, I've always collected games that were on Mike Etler's
list. Most people who started collecting back in the day used that
list. And now, even though there is better lists out there (like this
site), that list is still in the backs of the minds of the old
collectors - who usually have a big influence on what people consider a
"Complete" collection.
I used the Etler list way back... I got it off of tsr's awesome site. It was the only thing out there. Am I an "old collector"?
No
I wouldn't stop at the Tengen games. I would include all the unlicensed
games ( Cheetahman II is debatable) that are on the 1997 Mike Etlers
list.
I believe that the unlicensed games on the Etler list
were found in stores at some point. Now maybe not all of them were
available in your area, maybe not in any of the large chain stores, but
sold somewhere for them to get sold to the public. That is why I said
sold in American stores.
Hmm... well we all have our own definitions, but Cheetahman 2 isn't even debatable to me - it was not released, and no one ever purchased it in a store. For that matter, Action 52 wasn't really either, so I wouldn't even put that on my list. Sorry Active Enterprises!
And yes, I'm sure Master Chu and the Drunkard Hu was sold in a store somewhere in the U.S., but you'd have to go to Bobby Joe's Snake & Game Emporium in order to get one. Is that store-released? Technically, yes. But to me it wasn't widely released to the public, so it's off the list.
Just my stupid opinion. I don't know much about the NES anyway.
Oh and I like your vids Pat
We're talking about GAME LISTS - it's inherently unimportant.
And thanks.
10% seems generous too, and if it wasn't for tengen and camerica that number would be lower indeed.
As for other unlicensed games. Well, I haven't even gotten my hands on all the common licensed carts I want, so I'm not thinking about unlicensed rarities right now. Though I will say "Chiller" has really sparked my interested and I do plan on getting it sometime in the future.
I am collecting Tengen because
a) they were a licensee
b) they look slick
c) Tengen tetris was like $35 at funco land and I was always curious why!
this is the big reason!
d) I owned two of them when I was a kid (Pac-Man and Shinobi)
The other games do not appeal to me! Besides it is my colelction and I can do what I want!
Like MasonSushi, I've always collected games that were on Mike Etler's
list. Most people who started collecting back in the day used that
list. And now, even though there is better lists out there (like this
site), that list is still in the backs of the minds of the old
collectors - who usually have a big influence on what people consider a
"Complete" collection.
I used the Etler list way back... I got it off of tsr's awesome site. It was the only thing out there. Am I an "old collector"?
No
I wouldn't stop at the Tengen games. I would include all the unlicensed
games ( Cheetahman II is debatable) that are on the 1997 Mike Etlers
list.
I believe that the unlicensed games on the Etler list
were found in stores at some point. Now maybe not all of them were
available in your area, maybe not in any of the large chain stores, but
sold somewhere for them to get sold to the public. That is why I said
sold in American stores.
Hmm... well we all have our own definitions, but Cheetahman 2 isn't even debatable to me - it was not released, and no one ever purchased it in a store. For that matter, Action 52 wasn't really either, so I wouldn't even put that on my list. Sorry Active Enterprises!
And yes, I'm sure Master Chu and the Drunkard Hu was sold in a store somewhere in the U.S., but you'd have to go to Bobby Joe's Snake & Game Emporium in order to get one. Is that store-released? Technically, yes. But to me it wasn't widely released to the public, so it's off the list.
Just my stupid opinion. I don't know much about the NES anyway.
Oh and I like your vids Pat
We're talking about GAME LISTS - it's inherently unimportant.
And thanks.
Yea its unimportant. But fun to discuss none the less.
But i disagree about the statement about going to " Bobby Joe's Snake & Game Emporium" to find one game. How would that be any different than Stadium Events being put on the list? Yes it was licensed, but to my understanding; it was only available at a couple of Woolworth's in the N.E. part of the country. Going by that standard, it shouldn't be considered on the list because it wasn't available everywhere.
What about Flintstones 2? It was a rental only for Blockbuster, but not all Blockbusters get the same games? it could easily be that only certain states Blockbusters got it. Would that be on the list as well?
I agree with you about Cheetahmen II.
As far as the Action 52; it might or might not have seen "new" retail sale, but had to be sold somewhere. I believe there to be too many of them floating around to be just a "mail order only" game. I also believe that when Active Enterprises realized that a $200 cart didn't sell well via mail, that they clearanced them out to small business that would buy them thus allowing them to enter the retail market at a cheaper price. What didn't sell was converted into the Cheetamen II carts. Even if my theory doesn't hold water, rental places at some point also had to get rid of them at some point allowing them to enter the market used.
What I do not like about unlicensed games are the absence of end labels.