So the AVS will have it's own awesome wireless controllers eventually, but I was wondering if the system would be compatible with something like this little adapter from 8bitdo (and AnalogueNT): The Retro Reciever?
Admittedly, I find the idea of playing Mario with a ps4 controller slightly amusing.
I tried the SNES version of this adapter at E3 in 2015. It really is a cool little device. I've ordered the NES adapter, and hope the SNES adapter will be available soon. The controllers that go with them are also a nicely built with amazing battery life. The NES version would be a perfect match for the AVS.
I never knew Analogue NT had a role in the development of this product. I'd like to know more about that.
Yeah, I really like the quality of the NES30 game pad. I've had one for a few years now and it still works great. I ordered the reciver too ($20 is a steal honestly) and i'm really looking forward to trying it out on NES (and AVS!)
I wonder if there's a chance the NES adapter can simply detect SNES 16-bit polling signals and map the remaining buttons? I have some spliced 5-conductor extension cords that let me connect SNES controllers to NES and visa versa, though NES controllers cannot access A,X,L, and R. It would be worth a try. It is possible the NES and SNES devices might share the same firmware, kinda like how the RetroUSB NES adapter has 8 button inputs just like the SNES adapter.
I'm also wondering if two BT recievers will reliably work in tandem on NES being only an inch apart, or will there be crosstalk and signal attenuation issues? I remember having an issue years ago with the Mii Manager BT dongle for Windows where the Bluetooth dongle and Wiimote would fail to sync if I laid them on top of each other...
As for the AVS, all NES peripherals work with it, including the Zapper. Light detect and trigger pull on the Zapper do technically still function; it's just your HDTV won't transmit the proper beam pattern. All you need is a 15kHz strobe light that blinks with perfect timing. Fabricate a 15kHz LED strobe circuit on top of the AVS and point your lightgun at it?
On the regular release, no. If there are only dozens/hundreds of buyers I will be homeless
Originally posted by: Rockhart
So the AVS will have it's own awesome wireless controllers eventually, but I was wondering if the system would be compatible with something like this little adapter from 8bitdo:
It should be, if you want to use inferior controllers I rejected bluetooth a while ago because of lag, power usage (they get 10 hours, I get 100+), and because I am not chinese so I can't buy the BT modules that cheap.
will there be a price difference between the special clear ones and the regular ones? I figure at the very least shipping will be a bit more due to wood box and all that.
will there be a price difference between the special clear ones and the regular ones? I figure at the very least shipping will be a bit more due to wood box and all that.
Read much?
Originally posted by: bunnyboy
Originally posted by: GibbyVA
Will there be a limit per customer on the 90 you list on retrousb?
If its on the website, the limit will be 1.
Originally posted by: Kosmic StarDust
If it's only $50 more, I'd probably splurge on an LE though.
Thats hilarious! $50 more doesn't even cover the materials costs.
Expect to pay well over a $50 premium for owning an LE...
On the regular release, no. If there are only dozens/hundreds of buyers I will be homeless
Originally posted by: Rockhart
So the AVS will have it's own awesome wireless controllers eventually, but I was wondering if the system would be compatible with something like this little adapter from 8bitdo:
It should be, if you want to use inferior controllers I rejected bluetooth a while ago because of lag, power usage (they get 10 hours, I get 100+), and because I am not chinese so I can't buy the BT modules that cheap.
1) Are you Brian Parker aka Bunnyboy ("I"s are underlined) posting as an alias, or do you just work for him?
2) I wouldn't call them inferior, necessarily. Top corporations like MS and Sony can't be wrong. BT isn't all bad but it depends on the amount of network congestion. That said, the wireless AVS controller will be a day one purchase for me. Until then, there is this:
At least both yours and the 8bitdo solution will be 1000x better than that 2.4Ghz wireless Messiah junk from 2004. I own one and it's rubbish, despite now being a collector's item.
Pretty much all wireless devices share the 2.4 band for strange legal reasons. Bluetooth and Wifi direct devices both use it as well. I would like to know what the AVS wireless would use.
I think the Wii uses 5ghz for the control pad to keep it apart from the 2.4 controllers and wifi chip. I'd like to see that band get more use.
Pretty much all wireless devices share the 2.4 band for strange legal reasons. Bluetooth and Wifi direct devices both use it as well. I would like to know what the AVS wireless would use.
I think the Wii uses 5ghz for the control pad to keep it apart from the 2.4 controllers and wifi chip. I'd like to see that band get more use.
Wii controllers use bluetooth. I use them as a wireless mouse on my computer sometimes, just point and click.
Pretty much all wireless devices share the 2.4 band for strange legal reasons. Bluetooth and Wifi direct devices both use it as well. I would like to know what the AVS wireless would use.
I think the Wii uses 5ghz for the control pad to keep it apart from the 2.4 controllers and wifi chip. I'd like to see that band get more use.
Originally posted by: gamer78
Originally posted by: mkiker2089
Wii controllers use bluetooth. I use them as a wireless mouse on my computer sometimes, just point and click.
I think hemeant the Wii-U Gamepad uses 5Ghz band. The other Nintendo controllers are standard bluetooth.
= = = = = = = =
@Brian, I would strongly recommend using the 5Ghz band if such a design is possible since 2.4Ghz is oversaturated by wifi and bluetooth devices. My fiance's apartment has over 20 wifi networks fighting for bandwidth. I was getting 39Mbs downlink on speedtest.net using my laptop wireless N, then I ran the test again a few minutes later and it dropped way down to below 2Mbs. Ethernet was nearly 90Mbs. I think I'm gonna get her a 25 foot ethernet cable and loop it behind the furniture so she can just plug in from the sofa and turn off wireless.
It's not so huge an issue for house dwellers due to the extra space, but it's a real problem for anyone living in apartment who has to share their walls with several neighbors. A 2.4Ghz device may get bad reception in such a crowded environ. However, assuming the baud rate for communication is exremely low, you could safely use it between popular bands like 1, 6, and 11 with minimal interferance from routers.
I vaguely remember in a previous discussion someone suggested using channels 3, 4, 8, and 9 for players 1-4 if you decided to go the 2.4Ghz route. This would separate the highly congested channels 1, 6, and 11 commonly used in North America. PAL regions use 13 channels, which could in theory split 3 channels across 1, 7, 13, or four channels across 1, 5, 9, and 13. In that last senario, you may opt to use channel #10 for player 4 insatead of #9, especially for PAL territories. But the best strategy (whether you ultimately decide to switch to 5Ghz or not) would be to use spread spectrum (best), or for the reciever and transmitter to do a handshake procedure where they auto select the least congested channel (good). Use a very high Q factor for the reciever whenever transmitting a relatively low bandwidth signal, as this will help to filter out any strong or highly congested sidebands.
The 8bitdo controller looks nice, but I have heard there are a few deal breaking problems with it. The first problem is the rechargable battery is soldered in place and so not easily replaced, which some users have had to do because their battery died early. Just using standard AA batteries would be a better design since there are plentiful, inexpensive high quality rechargable AA batteries. The "pre-charged" AA rechargables are my favorite because they can store a charge for a very long time.
The second problem with 8bitdo's controller is the D-pad. A purist knows the subtle and necessary differences between an OEM NES controller's D-pad versus any other D-pad. Even official Nintendo NES and SNES D-pads differ slightly with the SNES D-pad having "easier" hit diagonal directions.
RetroUSB is run by a purist, nearly fanatical NES enthusiast that makes NES hardware largely out of his passion for the NES, Famicom, and the scene. If RetroUSB makes a wireless NES controller, it will make a difference to a purist.
RetroUSB is run by a purist, nearly fanatical NES enthusiast that makes NES hardware largely out of his passion for the NES, Famicom, and the scene. If RetroUSB makes a wireless NES controller, it will make a difference to a purist.
RetroUSB is run by a purist, nearly fanatical NES enthusiast that makes NES hardware largely out of his passion for the NES, Famicom, and the scene. If RetroUSB makes a wireless NES controller, it will make a difference to a purist.
I enjoyed this part, that is all.
Yes, absolutely. I am not knocking anything RetroUSB has put out, and continue to reiterate my "if you build it, I will buy it..." stance.
I was merely illustrating that the 8bitdo controllers are nice for what they are. For the record, I've mostly used mine wired for PC emulation thus far. I assume the controller will continue to function normally through USB with exausted battery, provided it doesn't leak or explode.
will there be a price difference between the special clear ones and the regular ones? I figure at the very least shipping will be a bit more due to wood box and all that.
Yup, don't know the price difference because I don't know exactly what will be included yet. Will still be less than the NT.
Originally posted by: Kosmic StarDust
1) Are you Brian Parker aka Bunnyboy ("I"s are underlined) posting as an alias, or do you just work for him?
Sometimes!
Originally posted by: Kosmic StarDust
2) I wouldn't call them inferior, necessarily. Top corporations like MS and Sony can't be wrong. BT isn't all bad but it depends on the amount of network congestion.
For NES, they are. 2 way communication, discovery, and lossless transmission aren't needed. Those add delays and power usage.
Originally posted by: Kosmic StarDust
At least both yours and the 8bitdo solution will be 1000x better than that 2.4Ghz wireless Messiah junk from 2004. I own one and it's rubbish, despite now being a collector's item.
Those controllers are the exact opposite of the NEX, the wireless electronics are good but the plastics are bad.
Originally posted by: Kosmic StarDust
@Brian, I would strongly recommend using the 5Ghz band if such a design is possible
Possible, but nowhere near affordable.
Originally posted by: Kosmic StarDust
I vaguely remember in a previous discussion someone suggested using channels 3, 4, 8, and 9 for players 1-4 if you decided to go the 2.4Ghz route.
Wifi channels are wide, so the numbering makes no sense for something that is narrow. My frequencies avoid common wifi usage, and if you are doing single player you get 4 to choose from.
Originally posted by: jagasian
The 8bitdo controller looks nice, but I have heard there are a few deal breaking problems with it. The first problem is the rechargable battery is soldered in place and so not easily replaced, which some users have had to do because their battery died early. Just using standard AA batteries would be a better design since there are plentiful, inexpensive high quality rechargable AA batteries. The "pre-charged" AA rechargables are my favorite because they can store a charge for a very long time.
AA is too thick, thats why I went with PS3. Standard/cheap battery that will be around for a decade. Tho after work on the NES portable trying to fit in an 18650 might have been better because thats where all the capacity/price targetting is now.
On the topic of aftermarket NES controllers, has a good wired clone controller been made since the year 2000? I have a stockpile of OEM NES and OEM SNES controllers, but my NES stockpile is dwindling. The rubber dome key switches eventually wear out. I have tried random brands of clone controllers for NES and SNES and have yet to find one that isn't wildly off in either quality of the plastic casing or the D-pad precision or the key switch quality.
On the topic of aftermarket NES controllers, has a good wired clone controller been made since the year 2000? I have a stockpile of OEM NES and OEM SNES controllers, but my NES stockpile is dwindling. The rubber dome key switches eventually wear out. I have tried random brands of clone controllers for NES and SNES and have yet to find one that isn't wildly off in either quality of the plastic casing or the D-pad precision or the key switch quality.
I've ordered myself one of these to use until we can get the wireless ones.
I don't have a working NES at the moment though, so I won't be able to say how it is until we get the AVS. It seems to be well liked though, and it's cheap enough to hold me over.
@Bunnyboy, thanks for the clarification on those controllers. I have faith the wireless controllers will be good. Are you still planning to use microswitches instead of pads?
My wireless Nex had an issue with the Dpad that never worked right. I opened it up and there was a horrible circle pad with diagonal plastic blade shaped actuators on the bottom which depressed the microswitches. Horribly inaccurate. The buttons also left something to be desired, with wierd touch sensors for Start+Select+Turbo. I only realised after the fact there were Advantage inspired arcade controllers that got liquidated for cheap a few years ago. I wish I had one to use with my Nex transmitter. While we are on the subject of clones, I purchased a Gamerz Tech NES clone not long ago. It played Castlevania III as advertised, but it suffers from the same reversed duty cycles that plagued the 2004 Generation Nex and Yobos. Ear bleed! I thought the clone chip makers fixed that years ago...
Just hurry up and release the AVS and wireless controllers so I get something to play with this summer.......
RetroUSB is run by a purist, nearly fanatical NES enthusiast that makes NES hardware largely out of his passion for the NES, Famicom, and the scene. If RetroUSB makes a wireless NES controller, it will make a difference to a purist.
You know something? That's why I'm following this project. I got this feeling when I spoke with the RetroUSB guys at PRGE 2015. I remember asking one of them how much they paid for die tooling to make the plastic shell for the AVS. His response was something astronomically high. I remember thinking to myself that this was someone who was seriously devoted to their product as that was quite a major investment. At that point I was convinced. I told the guy that I would be his first customer, a guaranteed sale. I like reading comments like yours, it makes me feel that my faith in this crew is well founded.
Also means that with shipping it should still be under $200
I wanted to do the numbers with coins, but SMB has some interesting limits in the level compression. You can only have 3 or 4 objects per column. There is an object for vertical blocks (like the 5 block tall "1") but there isn't a vertical coin object. You can do horizontal rows of coins, but that doesn't help!
So glad it's finally this close to release, it's been a long time but it'll be worth it. Perfect picture and no more screwing around with the toaster style connector that's always given me grief.
Comments
So the AVS will have it's own awesome wireless controllers eventually, but I was wondering if the system would be compatible with something like this little adapter from 8bitdo (and AnalogueNT): The Retro Reciever?
Admittedly, I find the idea of playing Mario with a ps4 controller slightly amusing.
I tried the SNES version of this adapter at E3 in 2015. It really is a cool little device. I've ordered the NES adapter, and hope the SNES adapter will be available soon. The controllers that go with them are also a nicely built with amazing battery life. The NES version would be a perfect match for the AVS.
I never knew Analogue NT had a role in the development of this product. I'd like to know more about that.
Yeah, I really like the quality of the NES30 game pad. I've had one for a few years now and it still works great. I ordered the reciver too ($20 is a steal honestly) and i'm really looking forward to trying it out on NES (and AVS!)
I wonder if there's a chance the NES adapter can simply detect SNES 16-bit polling signals and map the remaining buttons? I have some spliced 5-conductor extension cords that let me connect SNES controllers to NES and visa versa, though NES controllers cannot access A,X,L, and R. It would be worth a try. It is possible the NES and SNES devices might share the same firmware, kinda like how the RetroUSB NES adapter has 8 button inputs just like the SNES adapter.
I'm also wondering if two BT recievers will reliably work in tandem on NES being only an inch apart, or will there be crosstalk and signal attenuation issues? I remember having an issue years ago with the Mii Manager BT dongle for Windows where the Bluetooth dongle and Wiimote would fail to sync if I laid them on top of each other...
As for the AVS, all NES peripherals work with it, including the Zapper. Light detect and trigger pull on the Zapper do technically still function; it's just your HDTV won't transmit the proper beam pattern. All you need is a 15kHz strobe light that blinks with perfect timing. Fabricate a 15kHz LED strobe circuit on top of the AVS and point your lightgun at it?
Are you expecting shortages?
On the regular release, no. If there are only dozens/hundreds of buyers I will be homeless
So the AVS will have it's own awesome wireless controllers eventually, but I was wondering if the system would be compatible with something like this little adapter from 8bitdo:
It should be, if you want to use inferior controllers I rejected bluetooth a while ago because of lag, power usage (they get 10 hours, I get 100+), and because I am not chinese so I can't buy the BT modules that cheap.
will there be a price difference between the special clear ones and the regular ones? I figure at the very least shipping will be a bit more due to wood box and all that.
Read much?
Will there be a limit per customer on the 90 you list on retrousb?
If its on the website, the limit will be 1.
If it's only $50 more, I'd probably splurge on an LE though.
Thats hilarious! $50 more doesn't even cover the materials costs.
Expect to pay well over a $50 premium for owning an LE...
Are you expecting shortages?
On the regular release, no. If there are only dozens/hundreds of buyers I will be homeless
So the AVS will have it's own awesome wireless controllers eventually, but I was wondering if the system would be compatible with something like this little adapter from 8bitdo:
It should be, if you want to use inferior controllers I rejected bluetooth a while ago because of lag, power usage (they get 10 hours, I get 100+), and because I am not chinese so I can't buy the BT modules that cheap.
1) Are you Brian Parker aka Bunnyboy ("I"s are underlined) posting as an alias, or do you just work for him?
2) I wouldn't call them inferior, necessarily. Top corporations like MS and Sony can't be wrong. BT isn't all bad but it depends on the amount of network congestion. That said, the wireless AVS controller will be a day one purchase for me. Until then, there is this:
http://www.8bitdo.com/retro-receiver-nes/
At least both yours and the 8bitdo solution will be 1000x better than that 2.4Ghz wireless Messiah junk from 2004. I own one and it's rubbish, despite now being a collector's item.
I think the Wii uses 5ghz for the control pad to keep it apart from the 2.4 controllers and wifi chip. I'd like to see that band get more use.
Pretty much all wireless devices share the 2.4 band for strange legal reasons. Bluetooth and Wifi direct devices both use it as well. I would like to know what the AVS wireless would use.
I think the Wii uses 5ghz for the control pad to keep it apart from the 2.4 controllers and wifi chip. I'd like to see that band get more use.
Wii controllers use bluetooth. I use them as a wireless mouse on my computer sometimes, just point and click.
Pretty much all wireless devices share the 2.4 band for strange legal reasons. Bluetooth and Wifi direct devices both use it as well. I would like to know what the AVS wireless would use.
I think the Wii uses 5ghz for the control pad to keep it apart from the 2.4 controllers and wifi chip. I'd like to see that band get more use.
Wii controllers use bluetooth. I use them as a wireless mouse on my computer sometimes, just point and click.
I think hemeant the Wii-U Gamepad uses 5Ghz band. The other Nintendo controllers are standard bluetooth.
= = = = = = = =
@Brian, I would strongly recommend using the 5Ghz band if such a design is possible since 2.4Ghz is oversaturated by wifi and bluetooth devices. My fiance's apartment has over 20 wifi networks fighting for bandwidth. I was getting 39Mbs downlink on speedtest.net using my laptop wireless N, then I ran the test again a few minutes later and it dropped way down to below 2Mbs. Ethernet was nearly 90Mbs. I think I'm gonna get her a 25 foot ethernet cable and loop it behind the furniture so she can just plug in from the sofa and turn off wireless.
It's not so huge an issue for house dwellers due to the extra space, but it's a real problem for anyone living in apartment who has to share their walls with several neighbors. A 2.4Ghz device may get bad reception in such a crowded environ. However, assuming the baud rate for communication is exremely low, you could safely use it between popular bands like 1, 6, and 11 with minimal interferance from routers.
I vaguely remember in a previous discussion someone suggested using channels 3, 4, 8, and 9 for players 1-4 if you decided to go the 2.4Ghz route. This would separate the highly congested channels 1, 6, and 11 commonly used in North America. PAL regions use 13 channels, which could in theory split 3 channels across 1, 7, 13, or four channels across 1, 5, 9, and 13. In that last senario, you may opt to use channel #10 for player 4 insatead of #9, especially for PAL territories. But the best strategy (whether you ultimately decide to switch to 5Ghz or not) would be to use spread spectrum (best), or for the reciever and transmitter to do a handshake procedure where they auto select the least congested channel (good). Use a very high Q factor for the reciever whenever transmitting a relatively low bandwidth signal, as this will help to filter out any strong or highly congested sidebands.
The second problem with 8bitdo's controller is the D-pad. A purist knows the subtle and necessary differences between an OEM NES controller's D-pad versus any other D-pad. Even official Nintendo NES and SNES D-pads differ slightly with the SNES D-pad having "easier" hit diagonal directions.
RetroUSB is run by a purist, nearly fanatical NES enthusiast that makes NES hardware largely out of his passion for the NES, Famicom, and the scene. If RetroUSB makes a wireless NES controller, it will make a difference to a purist.
Originally posted by: jagasian
...
RetroUSB is run by a purist, nearly fanatical NES enthusiast that makes NES hardware largely out of his passion for the NES, Famicom, and the scene. If RetroUSB makes a wireless NES controller, it will make a difference to a purist.
I enjoyed this part, that is all.
...
RetroUSB is run by a purist, nearly fanatical NES enthusiast that makes NES hardware largely out of his passion for the NES, Famicom, and the scene. If RetroUSB makes a wireless NES controller, it will make a difference to a purist.
I enjoyed this part, that is all.
Yes, absolutely. I am not knocking anything RetroUSB has put out, and continue to reiterate my "if you build it, I will buy it..." stance.
I was merely illustrating that the 8bitdo controllers are nice for what they are. For the record, I've mostly used mine wired for PC emulation thus far. I assume the controller will continue to function normally through USB with exausted battery, provided it doesn't leak or explode.
will there be a price difference between the special clear ones and the regular ones? I figure at the very least shipping will be a bit more due to wood box and all that.
Yup, don't know the price difference because I don't know exactly what will be included yet. Will still be less than the NT.
1) Are you Brian Parker aka Bunnyboy ("I"s are underlined) posting as an alias, or do you just work for him?
Sometimes!
2) I wouldn't call them inferior, necessarily. Top corporations like MS and Sony can't be wrong. BT isn't all bad but it depends on the amount of network congestion.
For NES, they are. 2 way communication, discovery, and lossless transmission aren't needed. Those add delays and power usage.
At least both yours and the 8bitdo solution will be 1000x better than that 2.4Ghz wireless Messiah junk from 2004. I own one and it's rubbish, despite now being a collector's item.
Those controllers are the exact opposite of the NEX, the wireless electronics are good but the plastics are bad.
@Brian, I would strongly recommend using the 5Ghz band if such a design is possible
Possible, but nowhere near affordable.
I vaguely remember in a previous discussion someone suggested using channels 3, 4, 8, and 9 for players 1-4 if you decided to go the 2.4Ghz route.
Wifi channels are wide, so the numbering makes no sense for something that is narrow. My frequencies avoid common wifi usage, and if you are doing single player you get 4 to choose from.
The 8bitdo controller looks nice, but I have heard there are a few deal breaking problems with it. The first problem is the rechargable battery is soldered in place and so not easily replaced, which some users have had to do because their battery died early. Just using standard AA batteries would be a better design since there are plentiful, inexpensive high quality rechargable AA batteries. The "pre-charged" AA rechargables are my favorite because they can store a charge for a very long time.
AA is too thick, thats why I went with PS3. Standard/cheap battery that will be around for a decade. Tho after work on the NES portable trying to fit in an 18650 might have been better because thats where all the capacity/price targetting is now.
On the topic of aftermarket NES controllers, has a good wired clone controller been made since the year 2000? I have a stockpile of OEM NES and OEM SNES controllers, but my NES stockpile is dwindling. The rubber dome key switches eventually wear out. I have tried random brands of clone controllers for NES and SNES and have yet to find one that isn't wildly off in either quality of the plastic casing or the D-pad precision or the key switch quality.
I've ordered myself one of these to use until we can get the wireless ones.
I don't have a working NES at the moment though, so I won't be able to say how it is until we get the AVS. It seems to be well liked though, and it's cheap enough to hold me over.
My wireless Nex had an issue with the Dpad that never worked right. I opened it up and there was a horrible circle pad with diagonal plastic blade shaped actuators on the bottom which depressed the microswitches. Horribly inaccurate. The buttons also left something to be desired, with wierd touch sensors for Start+Select+Turbo. I only realised after the fact there were Advantage inspired arcade controllers that got liquidated for cheap a few years ago. I wish I had one to use with my Nex transmitter. While we are on the subject of clones, I purchased a Gamerz Tech NES clone not long ago. It played Castlevania III as advertised, but it suffers from the same reversed duty cycles that plagued the 2004 Generation Nex and Yobos. Ear bleed! I thought the clone chip makers fixed that years ago...
Just hurry up and release the AVS and wireless controllers so I get something to play with this summer.......
... the LLE will come with a fancy new controller...
What! That's great news! I'll bet that James guy has a pretty credible source for this info! Day 1 buy for sure!
RetroUSB is run by a purist, nearly fanatical NES enthusiast that makes NES hardware largely out of his passion for the NES, Famicom, and the scene. If RetroUSB makes a wireless NES controller, it will make a difference to a purist.
You know something? That's why I'm following this project. I got this feeling when I spoke with the RetroUSB guys at PRGE 2015. I remember asking one of them how much they paid for die tooling to make the plastic shell for the AVS. His response was something astronomically high. I remember thinking to myself that this was someone who was seriously devoted to their product as that was quite a major investment. At that point I was convinced. I told the guy that I would be his first customer, a guaranteed sale. I like reading comments like yours, it makes me feel that my faith in this crew is well founded.
Can't wait!!
I wanted to do the numbers with coins, but SMB has some interesting limits in the level compression. You can only have 3 or 4 objects per column. There is an object for vertical blocks (like the 5 block tall "1") but there isn't a vertical coin object. You can do horizontal rows of coins, but that doesn't help!