I personally never accept 2nd chance offers and I think most collectors do the same. If I was really the highest bid of the legit bidders, I'll wait for you to auction it again and take my chances at getting it cheaper.
It's hard to tell considering many of these same people claimed conspiracy regarding a 5 screw stadium events on little more than a hunch. That's why proof is so important. To say that 'everyone who bid over a certain amount is a fraud' is a serious charge. It requires more than hunches. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. And this holds true regardless of the charge of conspiracy or fraud.
It's easy to find out. Muresan goes down the list of bidders and offers it to each of them at their highest bid. Those who back out are frauds. Might not catch all of them, but I bet it knocks down a good chunk.
What you just said doesnt make sense. I've had auctions end where the top bidder didnt pay so i went to the next bidder with a 2nd chance offer but they didnt take it,neither did the next person. Does this make them fake? No. Maybe they were upset they didnt win it and move unto browsing for other things.
Another thing,lets say bidder 1 bids 5 times so $1000 then $2000 then $3000 then $4000 then $5000. bidder 2 only bids 4 times (4th bid was at $4,500). Bidder 1 wins at $5000 but doesnt pay so i go to bidder 2 ($4500) would bidder 2's bid of $4500 exist if bidder 1 didnt bid 5 times (including the $3000 then $4000 etc). As you can see bidder 1 jacked up the price 5 times. Had he not made any bids bidder 2 would only bid maybe 2 times $1000 to $2000 and it would be low as hell. If this were the case i wouldnt take the 2nd chance offer either. Just because they dont accept his 2nd chance offer doesnt make them fake
99.9% of the time I would not accept a 2nd chance offer myself
Though it would be nice to have actual proof of a large conspiracy perpetrated by dozens of different accounts and/or people. As with all conspiracy theories, extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.
No need for a conspiracy. Two words: mob mentality.
Agreed and exactly. Conspiracy isn't as likely as market fundamentals taking hold.
You are confusing a relatively small number of independently acting internet trolls with market fundamentals.
dismiss Occam all you want, but the simplest explanation for outrageous bidding on a very highly publicized item is that people just wanted in on the prank.
every last one of them knew they wouldn't actually have to pay if they ended up holding the bag.
I just heard a video game sold for $100k. Where is the thread to talk about it? I have a super Mario duck shoot game. I know what it's worth. Don't low ball me.
Please find a different venue to argue, use all your big words, and endlessly and pointlessly try to out philosophize each other. This was a fun thread to follow until your rants began.
Any update from muresan on the rest of the bidders and the outcome with ebay?
Not as of yet. Basically, the top bidder was issued a non-paying bidder strike by ebay (little does that help me.) I offered the title to the second highest bidder and gave them until today to respond. My guess is they won't. The best I can do is offer it to another bidder after the day time frame has expired to see if this next person really wanted the cart. I could just relist it so the entire world knows how much of a fraud ebay is not protecting sellers but I'm not sure that's the right course of action either at this point. This is the holding pattern for now...second chance offer it to the next person, wait a day, second chance offer it to the next person, wait a day, etc, etc.
Thanks for the update! I think most of the community is behind you finding the best way for you to get paid the most amount, with the least amount of hassle, while exposing the treacherous flaws in Ebay's system with a situation like this. Again, best of luck my friend. Keep us updated.
If you end up not selling it through the second chance system I highly suggest you auction it off at GameGavel or here on NA. At least that will be a relatively safe sale compared to eBay.
Thanks for the update! I think most of the community is behind you finding the best way for you to get paid the most amount, with the least amount of hassle, while exposing the treacherous flaws in Ebay's system with a situation like this. Again, best if luck my friend. Keep us updated.
While it can suck from the seller's perspective, there is nothing "treacherous" about it.
the seller loses nothing when a buyer doesn't pay. It is simply irritating, but there is no real loss.
Even if this was something like a real life real estate transaction for hundreds of thousands of dollars there is a "cool down" period where you can back out and only risk your earnest money (that said, probably the only way eBay could fix this sort of thing would be to have an earnest money system for high value auctions - if the buyer declines to pay the seller still gets that fee and can try again)
I think the answer is to have a more transparent method to identify non-payers. Not even allowing negative feedback is a grossly misguided attempt at buyer protection. That is what I meant. I didn't mean to use the word treacherous, my two year old did that.
Buyers of high dollar items for live auctions require bidders to pre-qualify. Not everyone can bid on a Picasso painting, win and then say just foolin.
Buyers of high dollar items for live auctions require bidders to pre-qualify. Not everyone can bid on a Picasso painting, win and then say just foolin.
I guess the real question comes down to how does eBay handle the Ferarris, etc, that end up in eBay motors?
seems like they could do the same thing for premium collectibles.
Could the threshold for a "high dollar item" be 100k? That could explain the weird ceiling the bidding hit and remained at the last hour or so of the auction. That would also explain the reason that someone was able to bid 99,900 and say just foolin.
I think if people bid on high valuable items, then back out they are billed the e-bay fees and must pay a 1-5% to the seller. It is highly time consuming on the sellers and e-bays ends for dealing with troublesome people.
Allowing people to just bid without regard is one of the dumbest things you can allow. I can essentially bid up every single auction and never have punishment for not paying if I do end up winning.
How do taxes work in this situation....also the ebay fees?
I have a feeling the IRS wants a chunk.
If this particular item is paid via Paypal, in January 2015 they will send the IRS a Form 1099-K reporting the seller's income for 2014. As for the fees, between eBay and Paypal they would be around 11-12% of the sale price.
How do taxes work in this situation....also the ebay fees?
I have a feeling the IRS wants a chunk.
If this particular item is paid via Paypal, in January 2015 they will send the IRS a Form 1099-K reporting the seller's income for 2014. As for the fees, between eBay and Paypal they would be around 11-12% of the sale price.
Item isn't paid for, could not be paid for in one transaction on PayPal (10,000 max transaction amount) Ebay fee is capped at $250 paypal fee is 2.9 %
He would not get a 1099 unless he also had 200 transactions via paypal in 2014 that is the rule $20,000 AND 200 transactions
When he filed the transaction cancel or non paying bidder he gets the refund automaticly to his ebay account ebay bills monthly at different cycles my bill comes out on the 15th due on the 22nd
How do taxes work in this situation....also the ebay fees?
I have a feeling the IRS wants a chunk.
If this particular item is paid via Paypal, in January 2015 they will send the IRS a Form 1099-K reporting the seller's income for 2014. As for the fees, between eBay and Paypal they would be around 11-12% of the sale price.
Item isn't paid for, could not be paid for in one transaction on PayPal (10,000 max transaction amount) Ebay fee is capped at $250 paypal fee is 2.9 %
He would not get a 1099 unless he also had 200 transactions via paypal in 2014 that is the rule $20,000 AND 200 transactions
It is too much money too assume that if he is paid it won't be reported. If not at Paypal then at his bank
Not as of yet. Basically, the top bidder was issued a non-paying bidder strike by ebay (little does that help me.) I offered the title to the second highest bidder and gave them until today to respond. My guess is they won't. The best I can do is offer it to another bidder after the day time frame has expired to see if this next person really wanted the cart. I could just relist it so the entire world knows how much of a fraud ebay is not protecting sellers but I'm not sure that's the right course of action either at this point. This is the holding pattern for now...second chance offer it to the next person, wait a day, second chance offer it to the next person, wait a day, etc, etc.
I would try to communicate with the media outlets that covered the auction to begin with. One of them would certainly bite on a story about the corrupted auction and ebay's policies that leave the seller in a bind. If there is no negative consequence to either the buyer or ebay then the whole thing is a waste of time and will continue to occur in the future.
How do taxes work in this situation....also the ebay fees?
I have a feeling the IRS wants a chunk.
If this particular item is paid via Paypal, in January 2015 they will send the IRS a Form 1099-K reporting the seller's income for 2014. As for the fees, between eBay and Paypal they would be around 11-12% of the sale price.
Item isn't paid for, could not be paid for in one transaction on PayPal (10,000 max transaction amount) Ebay fee is capped at $250 paypal fee is 2.9 %
He would not get a 1099 unless he also had 200 transactions via paypal in 2014 that is the rule $20,000 AND 200 transactions
It is too much money too assume that if he is paid it won't be reported. If not at Paypal then at his bank
No shit I would claim it too
I did not say not claim it or hide it etc, but paypal will not report it unless the 2 conditions are made.
You would be nuts not to claim this on your taxes if you got paid with all the coverage
It is too much money too assume that if he is paid it won't be reported. If not at Paypal then at his bank
No shit I would claim it too
I did not say not claim it or hide it etc, but paypal will not report it unless the 2 conditions are made.
You would be nuts not to claim this on your taxes if you got paid with all the coverage
Paypal says they will automatically report when certain conditions are met. This does not mean that they don't have the option to report it beforehand. Banks and post offices are the same way. If you meet certain criteria you are automatically reported but if they see what they consider suspicious behavior they can and will do so for less then the mimimum requirements.
It is too much money too assume that if he is paid it won't be reported. If not at Paypal then at his bank
No shit I would claim it too
I did not say not claim it or hide it etc, but paypal will not report it unless the 2 conditions are made.
You would be nuts not to claim this on your taxes if you got paid with all the coverage
Paypal says they will automatically report when certain conditions are met. This does not mean that they don't have the option to report it beforehand. Banks and post offices are the same way. If you meet certain criteria you are automatically reported but if they see what they consider suspicious behavior they can and will do so for less then the mimimum requirements.
Banks aren't reporting suspicious or large deposits to the irs, anyway. Those get reported to the FBI. (And it actually is a crime to intentionally structure multiple deposits to stay below the $10k reporting threshold)
Comments
Originally posted by: jonebone
I personally never accept 2nd chance offers and I think most collectors do the same. If I was really the highest bid of the legit bidders, I'll wait for you to auction it again and take my chances at getting it cheaper.
Yup
Originally posted by: keytotruth
Originally posted by: Tulpa
Originally posted by: Revel8
It's hard to tell considering many of these same people claimed conspiracy regarding a 5 screw stadium events on little more than a hunch. That's why proof is so important. To say that 'everyone who bid over a certain amount is a fraud' is a serious charge. It requires more than hunches. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. And this holds true regardless of the charge of conspiracy or fraud.
It's easy to find out. Muresan goes down the list of bidders and offers it to each of them at their highest bid. Those who back out are frauds. Might not catch all of them, but I bet it knocks down a good chunk.
What you just said doesnt make sense. I've had auctions end where the top bidder didnt pay so i went to the next bidder with a 2nd chance offer but they didnt take it,neither did the next person. Does this make them fake? No. Maybe they were upset they didnt win it and move unto browsing for other things.
Another thing,lets say bidder 1 bids 5 times so $1000 then $2000 then $3000 then $4000 then $5000. bidder 2 only bids 4 times (4th bid was at $4,500). Bidder 1 wins at $5000 but doesnt pay so i go to bidder 2 ($4500) would bidder 2's bid of $4500 exist if bidder 1 didnt bid 5 times (including the $3000 then $4000 etc). As you can see bidder 1 jacked up the price 5 times. Had he not made any bids bidder 2 would only bid maybe 2 times $1000 to $2000 and it would be low as hell. If this were the case i wouldnt take the 2nd chance offer either. Just because they dont accept his 2nd chance offer doesnt make them fake
99.9% of the time I would not accept a 2nd chance offer myself
Originally posted by: Revel8
Originally posted by: Tulpa
Originally posted by: Revel8
Though it would be nice to have actual proof of a large conspiracy perpetrated by dozens of different accounts and/or people. As with all conspiracy theories, extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.
No need for a conspiracy. Two words: mob mentality.
Agreed and exactly. Conspiracy isn't as likely as market fundamentals taking hold.
You are confusing a relatively small number of independently acting internet trolls with market fundamentals.
dismiss Occam all you want, but the simplest explanation for outrageous bidding on a very highly publicized item is that people just wanted in on the prank.
every last one of them knew they wouldn't actually have to pay if they ended up holding the bag.
Any update from muresan on the rest of the bidders and the outcome with ebay?
Originally posted by: Eatarick
Thanks for the update! I think most of the community is behind you finding the best way for you to get paid the most amount, with the least amount of hassle, while exposing the treacherous flaws in Ebay's system with a situation like this. Again, best if luck my friend. Keep us updated.
While it can suck from the seller's perspective, there is nothing "treacherous" about it.
the seller loses nothing when a buyer doesn't pay. It is simply irritating, but there is no real loss.
Even if this was something like a real life real estate transaction for hundreds of thousands of dollars there is a "cool down" period where you can back out and only risk your earnest money (that said, probably the only way eBay could fix this sort of thing would be to have an earnest money system for high value auctions - if the buyer declines to pay the seller still gets that fee and can try again)
Originally posted by: buyatari2
Buyers of high dollar items for live auctions require bidders to pre-qualify. Not everyone can bid on a Picasso painting, win and then say just foolin.
I guess the real question comes down to how does eBay handle the Ferarris, etc, that end up in eBay motors?
seems like they could do the same thing for premium collectibles.
I have a feeling the IRS wants a chunk.
Allowing people to just bid without regard is one of the dumbest things you can allow. I can essentially bid up every single auction and never have punishment for not paying if I do end up winning.
Originally posted by: MAIL_BAG
How do taxes work in this situation....also the ebay fees?
I have a feeling the IRS wants a chunk.
The irs doesn't even know about it unless eBay files a 1099 or the buyer reports income. (Neither of which take place if money never changes hands)
if he did sell, though, he owes the collectibles rate on income (28%).
Originally posted by: MAIL_BAG
How do taxes work in this situation....also the ebay fees?
I have a feeling the IRS wants a chunk.
If this particular item is paid via Paypal, in January 2015 they will send the IRS a Form 1099-K reporting the seller's income for 2014. As for the fees, between eBay and Paypal they would be around 11-12% of the sale price.
Originally posted by: GhaleonsDeadMyFriend
Originally posted by: MAIL_BAG
How do taxes work in this situation....also the ebay fees?
I have a feeling the IRS wants a chunk.
If this particular item is paid via Paypal, in January 2015 they will send the IRS a Form 1099-K reporting the seller's income for 2014. As for the fees, between eBay and Paypal they would be around 11-12% of the sale price.
Item isn't paid for, could not be paid for in one transaction on PayPal (10,000 max transaction amount) Ebay fee is capped at $250 paypal fee is 2.9 %
He would not get a 1099 unless he also had 200 transactions via paypal in 2014 that is the rule $20,000 AND 200 transactions
Originally posted by: Dennis Fleaman
I wonder if Muresan already got a bill from ebay?
When he filed the transaction cancel or non paying bidder he gets the refund automaticly to his ebay account ebay bills monthly at different cycles my bill comes out on the 15th due on the 22nd
Originally posted by: pats1717
Originally posted by: GhaleonsDeadMyFriend
Originally posted by: MAIL_BAG
How do taxes work in this situation....also the ebay fees?
I have a feeling the IRS wants a chunk.
If this particular item is paid via Paypal, in January 2015 they will send the IRS a Form 1099-K reporting the seller's income for 2014. As for the fees, between eBay and Paypal they would be around 11-12% of the sale price.
Item isn't paid for, could not be paid for in one transaction on PayPal (10,000 max transaction amount) Ebay fee is capped at $250 paypal fee is 2.9 %
He would not get a 1099 unless he also had 200 transactions via paypal in 2014 that is the rule $20,000 AND 200 transactions
It is too much money too assume that if he is paid it won't be reported. If not at Paypal then at his bank
Originally posted by: Muresan
Not as of yet. Basically, the top bidder was issued a non-paying bidder strike by ebay (little does that help me.) I offered the title to the second highest bidder and gave them until today to respond. My guess is they won't. The best I can do is offer it to another bidder after the day time frame has expired to see if this next person really wanted the cart. I could just relist it so the entire world knows how much of a fraud ebay is not protecting sellers but I'm not sure that's the right course of action either at this point. This is the holding pattern for now...second chance offer it to the next person, wait a day, second chance offer it to the next person, wait a day, etc, etc.
I would try to communicate with the media outlets that covered the auction to begin with. One of them would certainly bite on a story about the corrupted auction and ebay's policies that leave the seller in a bind. If there is no negative consequence to either the buyer or ebay then the whole thing is a waste of time and will continue to occur in the future.
Originally posted by: buyatari2
Originally posted by: pats1717
Originally posted by: GhaleonsDeadMyFriend
Originally posted by: MAIL_BAG
How do taxes work in this situation....also the ebay fees?
I have a feeling the IRS wants a chunk.
If this particular item is paid via Paypal, in January 2015 they will send the IRS a Form 1099-K reporting the seller's income for 2014. As for the fees, between eBay and Paypal they would be around 11-12% of the sale price.
Item isn't paid for, could not be paid for in one transaction on PayPal (10,000 max transaction amount) Ebay fee is capped at $250 paypal fee is 2.9 %
He would not get a 1099 unless he also had 200 transactions via paypal in 2014 that is the rule $20,000 AND 200 transactions
It is too much money too assume that if he is paid it won't be reported. If not at Paypal then at his bank
No shit I would claim it too
I did not say not claim it or hide it etc, but paypal will not report it unless the 2 conditions are made.
You would be nuts not to claim this on your taxes if you got paid with all the coverage
Originally posted by: pats1717
Item isn't paid for, could not be paid for in one transaction on PayPal (10,000 max transaction amount) Ebay fee is capped at $250 paypal fee is 2.9 %
He would not get a 1099 unless he also had 200 transactions via paypal in 2014 that is the rule $20,000 AND 200 transactions
Fun fact: I have seen reliable reports of paypal generating a 1099k this year when NEITHER threshold was met.
the 20k and 200 transactions is where they are required by law to do it. They are allowed to do it for any amount.
Originally posted by: pats1717
Originally posted by: buyatari2
It is too much money too assume that if he is paid it won't be reported. If not at Paypal then at his bank
No shit I would claim it too
I did not say not claim it or hide it etc, but paypal will not report it unless the 2 conditions are made.
You would be nuts not to claim this on your taxes if you got paid with all the coverage
Paypal says they will automatically report when certain conditions are met. This does not mean that they don't have the option to report it beforehand. Banks and post offices are the same way. If you meet certain criteria you are automatically reported but if they see what they consider suspicious behavior they can and will do so for less then the mimimum requirements.
Originally posted by: buyatari2
Originally posted by: pats1717
Originally posted by: buyatari2
It is too much money too assume that if he is paid it won't be reported. If not at Paypal then at his bank
No shit I would claim it too
I did not say not claim it or hide it etc, but paypal will not report it unless the 2 conditions are made.
You would be nuts not to claim this on your taxes if you got paid with all the coverage
Paypal says they will automatically report when certain conditions are met. This does not mean that they don't have the option to report it beforehand. Banks and post offices are the same way. If you meet certain criteria you are automatically reported but if they see what they consider suspicious behavior they can and will do so for less then the mimimum requirements.
Banks aren't reporting suspicious or large deposits to the irs, anyway. Those get reported to the FBI. (And it actually is a crime to intentionally structure multiple deposits to stay below the $10k reporting threshold)