David Crane has stated in interviews that he is mainly interested in coming up with cool programming tricks and that designing a game in which to use them is somewhat of an afterthought. In Pitfall he was mainly concerned with making a little animated running guy. This mindset is especially evident in a boy and his blob... Awesome gimmick with the shapeshifting blob character... the actual levels and puzzles in which it is applied are somewhat lacking.
I actually did not know that, that's interesting! Thanks for sharing.
And no, not being sarcastic. Although it's hard to tell on the internet ^^
Here is a quote from Racing the Beam:
David Crane’s design philosophy was quite different from Cartwright’s. Crane saw Atari VCS development less as a refinement of the gameplay in known interaction models and more as a challenge to make the highly constrained VCS hardware do new and exciting things. In Crane’s words, “I got more enjoyment out of discovering a new trick than from the game design itself. More often than not, I used this technique to lead me in a new direction of game design, and some of the tricks were to me as much an accomplishment as solving the Rubik’s Cube the first time.”
First, games considered bad I don't think are bad:
Godzilla - On nes, this is one I like that gets a lot of hate, more than I think it should.
Color a Dino - Hell, I had one person say I don't like it. It's a fun toy, and purple fucking dinos! I actually played this a good amount on a game axe since I got them at the same time. It's not a game though, it's a toy, like the old dos paint programs. I'm not trying to create jack shit with it, I'm fuckin coloring!
Deadly Towers - I don't really LIKE this game, but it's not as bad as people say. As in, it's playable, but holy hell you really need a walkthrough for enjoyment of this game; as a map it out yourself game it sucks cause of the hidden BS. Or if you do map it out, you at least need to know how the hidden worlds work, and it also helps knowing your sword does improve later on.
E.T. - Why does this get so much hate? Honestly, people who say this is a bad game for the time are idiots, or only liked shooters\kaboom clones. People act like they can't excape the pits, that's like saying super mario sucks cause bowser hits you with hammers; you exit the bottom of the pits in ET, not the top\sides. And when you enter one, you need to catch yourself before you hit bottom. And considering it's just "press the big red button", it's pretty bad how many people don't figure that out. It's a fun game, with neat actions in the "power zones", and more to do than just "shoot shit or run around a maze", plus it had a fucking title screen. The only thing I dislike is then humans show up during the clock countdown. More fun to play the patched version. And the whole "It caused the crash" is all bs, same as how people think the landfill was full of nothing but ET and pac-man carts.
Hidden object\popcap games - These things are cool, but a lot of "gamers" think they're not hardcore to play these games. I think you're not hardcore if you limit the type of games you play without at least trying other types.
Now for bad ones:
Barbi - Nes game. At first this seems like complete crap, and honestly, the first level is one of the worst in the game. But you need to think of it more as a platform puzzler, and then it's not nearly as bad, and you can get some enjoyment out of it. That last disco level BS sucks though.
Martial Champions - A Konami fighter before TMNT:TE, not a great game, but I was starving for fighters. STARVING!
War Gods - Not the best fighter, but I've had fun playing it. I forget all my moves in it though.
Drakken - I'm biased, cause it's one of my first games on snes, and you can strip down your girls to their underwear, always a plus. My parents got me this and a snes for chrhisitmas, and I was sneaking the game & system out of hiding and playing it to the point where drakken was beat before christmas day. Ooops.
David Crane has stated in interviews that he is mainly interested in coming up with cool programming tricks and that designing a game in which to use them is somewhat of an afterthought. In Pitfall he was mainly concerned with making a little animated running guy. This mindset is especially evident in a boy and his blob... Awesome gimmick with the shapeshifting blob character... the actual levels and puzzles in which it is applied are somewhat lacking.
I actually did not know that, that's interesting! Thanks for sharing.
And no, not being sarcastic. Although it's hard to tell on the internet ^^
Here is a quote from Racing the Beam:
David Crane’s design philosophy was quite different from Cartwright’s. Crane saw Atari VCS development less as a refinement of the gameplay in known interaction models and more as a challenge to make the highly constrained VCS hardware do new and exciting things. In Crane’s words, “I got more enjoyment out of discovering a new trick than from the game design itself. More often than not, I used this technique to lead me in a new direction of game design, and some of the tricks were to me as much an accomplishment as solving the Rubik’s Cube the first time.”
You can tell that's how he was thinking in the game dragster. Not a very fun game, but damn large sprites.
He also made little computer people, not a "game" well known here, but a nice sim\tamagotchi program
I'm going to jump on the "who doesn't like Excitebike?" train...er, bike...whatever. Maybe it's an age thing.
Interesting about Crane's way of working. I think Nintendo used to be that way when making new games (except with more interest in the final product.) Hence why their 3rd gen games had sequels that were so different from their predecessors. This is why I appreciate, for instance, Super Mario Land, and not NSMB Wii U.
E.T. - Why does this get so much hate? Honestly, people who say this is a bad game for the time are idiots, or only liked shooters\kaboom clones.
I was listing it because its a game I like! Its one of the more enjoyable 2600 games, but it definitely has some flaws.
Oh I wasn't talking about you, I don't think you're an idiot.
Which has a whole diffrent meaning than if I said:
Oh I wasn't talking about you, I don't think you're an idiot.
And now I have to go help my uncle Jack off a horse.
I never had the pleasure of playing ET back in the day, but I do remember firing it up when I got it and thinking it wasn't too bad. It definitely needs some polish, but considering the rush to push it out the door, it's not nearly as bad as it could've been.
And I'm just gonna leave the rest of that alone...
E.T. - Why does this get so much hate? Honestly, people who say this is a bad game for the time are idiots, or only liked shooters\kaboom clones.
I was listing it because its a game I like! Its one of the more enjoyable 2600 games, but it definitely has some flaws.
Oh I wasn't talking about you, I don't think you're an idiot.
Which has a whole diffrent meaning than if I said:
Oh I wasn't talking about you, I don't think you're an idiot.
And now I have to go help my uncle Jack off a horse.
I never had the pleasure of playing ET back in the day, but I do remember firing it up when I got it and thinking it wasn't too bad. It definitely needs some polish, but considering the rush to push it out the door, it's not nearly as bad as it could've been.
And I'm just gonna leave the rest of that alone...
Have you ever seen this? http://www.neocomputer.org/projects/et/ A damn good job fixing up ET. I've never played it on the real hardware, but was neat on emulator. But I understand how pits work, and that was the main fix.
Also, about the other part. Would it be more or less creepy to point out I don't have an uncle named Jack, that was just a typo?
But no, I've never seen it, and I'm probably not going to bother to play it either. The game works just fine, it just takes practice to learn how it all works.
Heh, I always considered Karnov to be a solid game especially when compared to other NES games from 1988. Anyway, for me it would have to be Bubsy. It's popular to hate it but I kinda like it. Double Dragon V is another one. People love to bash it but I find it to be a guilty pleasure! I love using Trigger Happy and Countdown. They have some cool moves
Objectively, I know it's terrible(especially the bit in the fifth level where you can't jump or get hit), but I do like Castlevania 64.
I got to play the Legacy of Darkness version and despite some platforming camera issues and the use of time in the art gallery, it was a very good game. It plays more of an action adventure game than an action sidecroller like the orignals that people are accustomed to.
I wish more people would admit that Xexyz is a bad game. I had never played it when I discovered my copy was a prototype. Heck, I didn't even know it was a copy of Xexyz because a part of the label was missing (yes, this prototype had a black and white upside-down label printed across two labels from label paper and on part was missing). Everything I knew about the game was from a video I had watched on AVGN/James Rolfe's channel where Mike praised it.
Don't get me wrong: the game deserves some credit for combining two different gameplay styles (three counting the final battle), but the platforming was uninspired and everything was cliché (Galaxy! Space! Save the princess!). With nothing outstanding about the "enter every door you see and pretend it's an adventure like Zelda II" gameplay, the novelty of combining shooters and platforming doesn't save it.
Speaking of Zelda II, the Zelda II-like "adventure" element in Xexyz is completely fake. They'll come up with some random thing you have to do to proceed and then put a door right there where someone tells you about it. Ooooo! Adventure. There's no mystery, there's no going back after a revelation or new ability. There's no progression of the story. The only way to miss that upgrade/power-up/bonus/"secret" was to completely ignore that door like a dumba**.
Wisdom Tree games. I know I beat all three of them on Bible Adventures (friend owned it) and really liked the Noah game. I owned King of Kings myself beat two of the three games and enjoyed it for the most part. I actually loved Spiritual Warfare when it was still current and rented it enough times to beat it with no guides or help. I had not played through Zelda to know what a rip off it was!
CZroe, I played Xexyz on a lark without really knowing anything about it, and thoroughly enjoyed it. That's generally how I like to go into a game...judge it on it's own merits rather than other people's opinions. That said, I also thoroughly enjoyed Conan, so take that for what you will.
I wish more people would admit that Xexyz is a bad game. I had never played it when I discovered my copy was a prototype. Heck, I didn't even know it was a copy of Xexyz because a part of the label was missing (yes, this prototype had a black and white upside-down label printed across two labels from label paper and on part was missing). Everything I knew about the game was from a video I had watched on AVGN/James Rolfe's channel where Mike praised it.
Don't get me wrong: the game deserves some credit for combining two different gameplay styles (three counting the final battle), but the platforming was uninspired and everything was cliché (Galaxy! Space! Save the princess!). With nothing outstanding about the "enter every door you see and pretend it's an adventure like Zelda II" gameplay, the novelty of combining shooters and platforming doesn't save it.
Speaking of Zelda II, the Zelda II-like "adventure" element in Xexyz is completely fake. They'll come up with some random thing you have to do to proceed and then put a door right there where someone tells you about it. Ooooo! Adventure. There's no mystery, there's no going back after a revelation or new ability. There's no progression of the story. The only way to miss that upgrade/power-up/bonus/"secret" was to completely ignore that door like a dumba**.
This is a fair assessment, but I think you're being too harsh. Xexyz does manage to carve out its own identity and is a great find for those of us who enjoy hybrid games. You have to at least admit that some of the horizontal shooting stages are impressive with how the screen can increase/decrease speed, and the music, while not necessarily memorable, is fun to listen to.
I wish more people would admit that Xexyz is a bad game. I had never played it when I discovered my copy was a prototype. Heck, I didn't even know it was a copy of Xexyz because a part of the label was missing (yes, this prototype had a black and white upside-down label printed across two labels from label paper and on part was missing). Everything I knew about the game was from a video I had watched on AVGN/James Rolfe's channel where Mike praised it.
Don't get me wrong: the game deserves some credit for combining two different gameplay styles (three counting the final battle), but the platforming was uninspired and everything was cliché (Galaxy! Space! Save the princess!). With nothing outstanding about the "enter every door you see and pretend it's an adventure like Zelda II" gameplay, the novelty of combining shooters and platforming doesn't save it.
Speaking of Zelda II, the Zelda II-like "adventure" element in Xexyz is completely fake. They'll come up with some random thing you have to do to proceed and then put a door right there where someone tells you about it. Ooooo! Adventure. There's no mystery, there's no going back after a revelation or new ability. There's no progression of the story. The only way to miss that upgrade/power-up/bonus/"secret" was to completely ignore that door like a dumba**.
xexyz.. Bad?... TAKE THAT BACK. No but seriously I played it briefly years ago and have fond memories but I haven't found a copy in the wild yet so it's been a while. For now I'll just pretend it's great until I give it another shot
I think the music to Xexyz is incredibly memorable, myself. The moment I saw the game mentioned, I had the little tune from the first level playing in my head. It's got at least three top-shelf songs, which matches any other NES game I can think of.
Comments
David Crane has stated in interviews that he is mainly interested in coming up with cool programming tricks and that designing a game in which to use them is somewhat of an afterthought. In Pitfall he was mainly concerned with making a little animated running guy. This mindset is especially evident in a boy and his blob... Awesome gimmick with the shapeshifting blob character... the actual levels and puzzles in which it is applied are somewhat lacking.
I actually did not know that, that's interesting! Thanks for sharing.
And no, not being sarcastic. Although it's hard to tell on the internet ^^
Here is a quote from Racing the Beam:
Godzilla - On nes, this is one I like that gets a lot of hate, more than I think it should.
Color a Dino - Hell, I had one person say I don't like it. It's a fun toy, and purple fucking dinos! I actually played this a good amount on a game axe since I got them at the same time. It's not a game though, it's a toy, like the old dos paint programs. I'm not trying to create jack shit with it, I'm fuckin coloring!
Deadly Towers - I don't really LIKE this game, but it's not as bad as people say. As in, it's playable, but holy hell you really need a walkthrough for enjoyment of this game; as a map it out yourself game it sucks cause of the hidden BS. Or if you do map it out, you at least need to know how the hidden worlds work, and it also helps knowing your sword does improve later on.
E.T. - Why does this get so much hate? Honestly, people who say this is a bad game for the time are idiots, or only liked shooters\kaboom clones. People act like they can't excape the pits, that's like saying super mario sucks cause bowser hits you with hammers; you exit the bottom of the pits in ET, not the top\sides. And when you enter one, you need to catch yourself before you hit bottom. And considering it's just "press the big red button", it's pretty bad how many people don't figure that out. It's a fun game, with neat actions in the "power zones", and more to do than just "shoot shit or run around a maze", plus it had a fucking title screen. The only thing I dislike is then humans show up during the clock countdown. More fun to play the patched version. And the whole "It caused the crash" is all bs, same as how people think the landfill was full of nothing but ET and pac-man carts.
Hidden object\popcap games - These things are cool, but a lot of "gamers" think they're not hardcore to play these games. I think you're not hardcore if you limit the type of games you play without at least trying other types.
Now for bad ones:
Barbi - Nes game. At first this seems like complete crap, and honestly, the first level is one of the worst in the game. But you need to think of it more as a platform puzzler, and then it's not nearly as bad, and you can get some enjoyment out of it. That last disco level BS sucks though.
Martial Champions - A Konami fighter before TMNT:TE, not a great game, but I was starving for fighters. STARVING!
War Gods - Not the best fighter, but I've had fun playing it. I forget all my moves in it though.
Drakken - I'm biased, cause it's one of my first games on snes, and you can strip down your girls to their underwear, always a plus. My parents got me this and a snes for chrhisitmas, and I was sneaking the game & system out of hiding and playing it to the point where drakken was beat before christmas day. Ooops.
Originally posted by: G-Type
Originally posted by: ifightdragons
Originally posted by: G-Type
David Crane has stated in interviews that he is mainly interested in coming up with cool programming tricks and that designing a game in which to use them is somewhat of an afterthought. In Pitfall he was mainly concerned with making a little animated running guy. This mindset is especially evident in a boy and his blob... Awesome gimmick with the shapeshifting blob character... the actual levels and puzzles in which it is applied are somewhat lacking.
I actually did not know that, that's interesting! Thanks for sharing.
And no, not being sarcastic. Although it's hard to tell on the internet ^^
Here is a quote from Racing the Beam:
You can tell that's how he was thinking in the game dragster. Not a very fun game, but damn large sprites.
He also made little computer people, not a "game" well known here, but a nice sim\tamagotchi program
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d8JaHD16lPI
Excitebike. Yeah, the original!
People don't like excitebike?
Excitebike. Yeah, the original!
People don't like excitebike?
The only comments I ever see about the game are negative so it's my perception it's a horrible game. But I enjoy it!
I love them to bits, but they aren't masterpieces by any means.
Interesting about Crane's way of working. I think Nintendo used to be that way when making new games (except with more interest in the final product.) Hence why their 3rd gen games had sequels that were so different from their predecessors. This is why I appreciate, for instance, Super Mario Land, and not NSMB Wii U.
Excitebike. Yeah, the original!
People don't like excitebike?
The only comments I ever see about the game are negative so it's my perception it's a horrible game. But I enjoy it!
Crazy. I loved that game back in the day.
The programable tracks blew my mind in the 1980s
Honestly it's fun today if 2 player mode and making custom tracks.
Perhaps drink a few beers first.
Originally posted by: Ozzy_98
E.T. - Why does this get so much hate? Honestly, people who say this is a bad game for the time are idiots, or only liked shooters\kaboom clones.
I was listing it because its a game I like! Its one of the more enjoyable 2600 games, but it definitely has some flaws.
E.T. - Why does this get so much hate? Honestly, people who say this is a bad game for the time are idiots, or only liked shooters\kaboom clones.
I was listing it because its a game I like! Its one of the more enjoyable 2600 games, but it definitely has some flaws.
Oh I wasn't talking about you, I don't think you're an idiot.
Which has a whole diffrent meaning than if I said:
Oh I wasn't talking about you, I don't think you're an idiot.
And now I have to go help my uncle Jack off a horse.
E.T. - Why does this get so much hate? Honestly, people who say this is a bad game for the time are idiots, or only liked shooters\kaboom clones.
I was listing it because its a game I like! Its one of the more enjoyable 2600 games, but it definitely has some flaws.
Oh I wasn't talking about you, I don't think you're an idiot.
Which has a whole diffrent meaning than if I said:
Oh I wasn't talking about you, I don't think you're an idiot.
And now I have to go help my uncle Jack off a horse.
I never had the pleasure of playing ET back in the day, but I do remember firing it up when I got it and thinking it wasn't too bad. It definitely needs some polish, but considering the rush to push it out the door, it's not nearly as bad as it could've been.
And I'm just gonna leave the rest of that alone...
E.T. - Why does this get so much hate? Honestly, people who say this is a bad game for the time are idiots, or only liked shooters\kaboom clones.
I was listing it because its a game I like! Its one of the more enjoyable 2600 games, but it definitely has some flaws.
Oh I wasn't talking about you, I don't think you're an idiot.
Which has a whole diffrent meaning than if I said:
Oh I wasn't talking about you, I don't think you're an idiot.
And now I have to go help my uncle Jack off a horse.
I never had the pleasure of playing ET back in the day, but I do remember firing it up when I got it and thinking it wasn't too bad. It definitely needs some polish, but considering the rush to push it out the door, it's not nearly as bad as it could've been.
And I'm just gonna leave the rest of that alone...
Have you ever seen this? http://www.neocomputer.org/projects/et/ A damn good job fixing up ET. I've never played it on the real hardware, but was neat on emulator. But I understand how pits work, and that was the main fix.
Also, about the other part. Would it be more or less creepy to point out I don't have an uncle named Jack, that was just a typo?
But no, I've never seen it, and I'm probably not going to bother to play it either. The game works just fine, it just takes practice to learn how it all works.
Karnov for me. Terrible game, but I love it
Heh, I always considered Karnov to be a solid game especially when compared to other NES games from 1988. Anyway, for me it would have to be Bubsy. It's popular to hate it but I kinda like it. Double Dragon V is another one. People love to bash it but I find it to be a guilty pleasure! I love using Trigger Happy and Countdown. They have some cool moves
Objectively, I know it's terrible(especially the bit in the fifth level where you can't jump or get hit), but I do like Castlevania 64.
I got to play the Legacy of Darkness version and despite some platforming camera issues and the use of time in the art gallery, it was a very good game. It plays more of an action adventure game than an action sidecroller like the orignals that people are accustomed to.
I wish more people would admit that Xexyz is a bad game. I had never played it when I discovered my copy was a prototype. Heck, I didn't even know it was a copy of Xexyz because a part of the label was missing (yes, this prototype had a black and white upside-down label printed across two labels from label paper and on part was missing). Everything I knew about the game was from a video I had watched on AVGN/James Rolfe's channel where Mike praised it.
Don't get me wrong: the game deserves some credit for combining two different gameplay styles (three counting the final battle), but the platforming was uninspired and everything was cliché (Galaxy! Space! Save the princess!). With nothing outstanding about the "enter every door you see and pretend it's an adventure like Zelda II" gameplay, the novelty of combining shooters and platforming doesn't save it.
Speaking of Zelda II, the Zelda II-like "adventure" element in Xexyz is completely fake. They'll come up with some random thing you have to do to proceed and then put a door right there where someone tells you about it. Ooooo! Adventure. There's no mystery, there's no going back after a revelation or new ability. There's no progression of the story. The only way to miss that upgrade/power-up/bonus/"secret" was to completely ignore that door like a dumba**.
Where are all you Xexyz fans?!
I wish more people would admit that Xexyz is a bad game. I had never played it when I discovered my copy was a prototype. Heck, I didn't even know it was a copy of Xexyz because a part of the label was missing (yes, this prototype had a black and white upside-down label printed across two labels from label paper and on part was missing). Everything I knew about the game was from a video I had watched on AVGN/James Rolfe's channel where Mike praised it.
Don't get me wrong: the game deserves some credit for combining two different gameplay styles (three counting the final battle), but the platforming was uninspired and everything was cliché (Galaxy! Space! Save the princess!). With nothing outstanding about the "enter every door you see and pretend it's an adventure like Zelda II" gameplay, the novelty of combining shooters and platforming doesn't save it.
Speaking of Zelda II, the Zelda II-like "adventure" element in Xexyz is completely fake. They'll come up with some random thing you have to do to proceed and then put a door right there where someone tells you about it. Ooooo! Adventure. There's no mystery, there's no going back after a revelation or new ability. There's no progression of the story. The only way to miss that upgrade/power-up/bonus/"secret" was to completely ignore that door like a dumba**.
This is a fair assessment, but I think you're being too harsh. Xexyz does manage to carve out its own identity and is a great find for those of us who enjoy hybrid games. You have to at least admit that some of the horizontal shooting stages are impressive with how the screen can increase/decrease speed, and the music, while not necessarily memorable, is fun to listen to.
Where are all you Xexyz fans?!
I wish more people would admit that Xexyz is a bad game. I had never played it when I discovered my copy was a prototype. Heck, I didn't even know it was a copy of Xexyz because a part of the label was missing (yes, this prototype had a black and white upside-down label printed across two labels from label paper and on part was missing). Everything I knew about the game was from a video I had watched on AVGN/James Rolfe's channel where Mike praised it.
Don't get me wrong: the game deserves some credit for combining two different gameplay styles (three counting the final battle), but the platforming was uninspired and everything was cliché (Galaxy! Space! Save the princess!). With nothing outstanding about the "enter every door you see and pretend it's an adventure like Zelda II" gameplay, the novelty of combining shooters and platforming doesn't save it.
Speaking of Zelda II, the Zelda II-like "adventure" element in Xexyz is completely fake. They'll come up with some random thing you have to do to proceed and then put a door right there where someone tells you about it. Ooooo! Adventure. There's no mystery, there's no going back after a revelation or new ability. There's no progression of the story. The only way to miss that upgrade/power-up/bonus/"secret" was to completely ignore that door like a dumba**.
xexyz.. Bad?... TAKE THAT BACK.
No but seriously I played it briefly years ago and have fond memories but I haven't found a copy in the wild yet so it's been a while. For now I'll just pretend it's great until I give it another shot
the music, while not necessarily memorable
I think the music to Xexyz is incredibly memorable, myself. The moment I saw the game mentioned, I had the little tune from the first level playing in my head. It's got at least three top-shelf songs, which matches any other NES game I can think of.
I'm going to jump on the "who doesn't like Excitebike?" train...er, bike...whatever. Maybe it's an age thing.
I never liked Excitebike much. I wouldn't call it a bad game though. Just not my thing and never got the appeal. Over-rated is what I would call it.
...
Super Mario Bros. 2 (USA)
This was very subtle trolling, top notch. I guess people didn't notice though.
Have and play Starcraft to this day....On the PC
Should have never been a console game lol