Hobby Lobby to pay $3 million fine, forfeit smuggled ancient artifacts
http://www.cnn.com/2017/07/05/us/hobby-lobby-ancient-artifacts-trnd/index.html
I mean...who the f**k did they have heading this endevour, Juno Skinner and Crimson Jihad???
I mean...who the f**k did they have heading this endevour, Juno Skinner and Crimson Jihad???
Comments
At least they're being cool about it.
Not surprising. They're bible thumpers through and through. Makes sense they're doing this.
...not following your logic. Sounds more like unjustified religion-bashing/intolerance to me.
Oh wait, no it doesn't. Jerks got (at least some of) what they deserved.
"Correction: This story has been edited to make clear that Hobby Lobby received falsely labeled artifacts from a supplier, according to the Department of Justice. The UAE-based dealers involved in the transactions falsely labeled the artifacts as "ceramics" and "samples" and illegally shipped them to Hobby Lobby stores and corporate affiliates in the United States, the DOJ said."
So, though HL is taking the fall, they aren't 100% at fault. Their main problem is that they didn't do their due diligence and it sounds as if when these were shipped, the selling organization is the one that mis-labeled them.
It's like shipping a video game to someone in Europe and on the customs form declaring them as "books", except on a much more expensive and important scale. Whose at fault? Well, in this case it's the recipient.
Not surprising. They're bible thumpers through and through. Makes sense they're doing this.
...not following your logic. Sounds more like unjustified religion-bashing/intolerance to me.
Do you expect anything less from someone who self diagnosed themselves and makes it a point to bring it up every chance she can? She's a wonderful ray of sunshine in all of her snowflake posts.
Quote:
"Correction: This story has been edited to make clear that Hobby Lobby received falsely labeled artifacts from a supplier, according to the Department of Justice. The UAE-based dealers involved in the transactions falsely labeled the artifacts as "ceramics" and "samples" and illegally shipped them to Hobby Lobby stores and corporate affiliates in the United States, the DOJ said."
So, though HL is taking the fall, they aren't 100% at fault. Their main problem is that they didn't do their due diligence and it sounds as if when these were shipped, the selling organization is the one that mis-labeled them.
It's like shipping a video game to someone in Europe and on the customs form declaring them as "books", except on a much more expensive and important scale. Whose at fault? Well, in this case it's the recipient.
Based on the article stating further up about how they were warned repeatedly about making sure where stuff came from and how it couldn't be labelled as being from Iraq due to many sites there having been looted, I'm personally pretty confident that they're 100% at fault. Have they gotten caught specifically telling whoever shipped them the artifacts to mislabel them? Not yet. Were they repeatedly warned about making 100% certain everything was squeakly clean before buying them? Yep. Based on the amount of warnings they got, I find it hard to believe that all the paperwork on every single item would be fouled up without their knowledge seeing as they needed "hey we can totally 100% prove none of this was stolen/looted we swear" documents for all of it.
Not surprising. They're bible thumpers through and through. Makes sense they're doing this.
What does that have to do with anything?
Not surprising. They're bible thumpers through and through. Makes sense they're doing this.
What does that have to do with anything?
It could be that Astor's area is infested with the same type of religious residents that mine is. I would say many or most, but I'll go with the most visible/vocal "religious" folks in my area (deep in the Bible Belt) will preach at, belittle, etc. others but don't actually follow any of the teachings of their particular tennet. They put in what's essentially face time at Church every Sunday but are in reality total garbage human beings who don't even try to follow any of the teachings that they're receiving each and every week all the while extoling upon anyone they deem unworthy or heathenlike how pious and awesome they are when they're anything but. Hobby Lobby (well, the private owners/controllers anyway) has a bit of the same issue where they've gone to great lengths to show how pious and "humble" they are but actually act quite the opposite. Proverbially getting their hands caught in the cookie jar in this instance (basically buying up artifacts which somehow lift up their religious beliefs that everyone warned them about being stolen then getting caught at it) isn't too shocking. Astor was just (more than a little) indelicate in expressing that lack of surprise.
Quote:
"Correction: This story has been edited to make clear that Hobby Lobby received falsely labeled artifacts from a supplier, according to the Department of Justice. The UAE-based dealers involved in the transactions falsely labeled the artifacts as "ceramics" and "samples" and illegally shipped them to Hobby Lobby stores and corporate affiliates in the United States, the DOJ said."
So, though HL is taking the fall, they aren't 100% at fault. Their main problem is that they didn't do their due diligence and it sounds as if when these were shipped, the selling organization is the one that mis-labeled them.
It's like shipping a video game to someone in Europe and on the customs form declaring them as "books", except on a much more expensive and important scale. Whose at fault? Well, in this case it's the recipient.
Based on the article stating further up about how they were warned repeatedly about making sure where stuff came from and how it couldn't be labelled as being from Iraq due to many sites there having been looted, I'm personally pretty confident that they're 100% at fault. Have they gotten caught specifically telling whoever shipped them the artifacts to mislabel them? Not yet. Were they repeatedly warned about making 100% certain everything was squeakly clean before buying them? Yep. Based on the amount of warnings they got, I find it hard to believe that all the paperwork on every single item would be fouled up without their knowledge seeing as they needed "hey we can totally 100% prove none of this was stolen/looted we swear" documents for all of it.
The family that owns Hobby Lobby has a keen interest in Biblical history, so I call bullshit that they were duped by the sellers. The family is looting the ruins of a war-torn country to enrich their bullshit museum.
Many people are willing to engage in just as offensive behavior every day, just not on a multi-million dollar scale. I'm not excusing their actions. I'm just saying I'm not surprised and I don't see them as "evil". Just behaving stupid and naively.
I'm not saying they aren't at fault. I'm really saying that this is a case of "selective ignorance". A bit of "Don't ask, don't tell" is what I think happened.
Many people are willing to engage in just as offensive behavior every day, just not on a multi-million dollar scale. I'm not excusing their actions. I'm just saying I'm not surprised and I don't see them as "evil". Just behaving stupid and naively.
Yeah, but at some point it becomes a little overwhelming to believe that this stuff wouldn't come from where it did.
That's like getting ivory from China from elephants that died of natural causes. If you're getting a thousand tusks a week, you should really be a bit suspicious.
Not surprising. They're bible thumpers through and through. Makes sense they're doing this.
What does that have to do with anything?
It could be that Astor's area is infested with the same type of religious residents that mine is. I would say many or most, but I'll go with the most visible/vocal "religious" folks in my area (deep in the Bible Belt) will preach at, belittle, etc. others but don't actually follow any of the teachings of their particular tennet. They put in what's essentially face time at Church every Sunday but are in reality total garbage human beings who don't even try to follow any of the teachings that they're receiving each and every week all the while extoling upon anyone they deem unworthy or heathenlike how pious and awesome they are when they're anything but...
I was going to say "oh you too?" then seen your from Tenn as well. I try to be open minded but its hard to hold any sort if respect for these religious chuckleheads damning everyone for everything. Hate lives in a small town. ANYWAY...
Quote:
"Correction: This story has been edited to make clear that Hobby Lobby received falsely labeled artifacts from a supplier, according to the Department of Justice. The UAE-based dealers involved in the transactions falsely labeled the artifacts as "ceramics" and "samples" and illegally shipped them to Hobby Lobby stores and corporate affiliates in the United States, the DOJ said."
So, though HL is taking the fall, they aren't 100% at fault. Their main problem is that they didn't do their due diligence and it sounds as if when these were shipped, the selling organization is the one that mis-labeled them.
It's like shipping a video game to someone in Europe and on the customs form declaring them as "books", except on a much more expensive and important scale. Whose at fault? Well, in this case it's the recipient.
Based on the article stating further up about how they were warned repeatedly about making sure where stuff came from and how it couldn't be labelled as being from Iraq due to many sites there having been looted, I'm personally pretty confident that they're 100% at fault. Have they gotten caught specifically telling whoever shipped them the artifacts to mislabel them? Not yet. Were they repeatedly warned about making 100% certain everything was squeakly clean before buying them? Yep. Based on the amount of warnings they got, I find it hard to believe that all the paperwork on every single item would be fouled up without their knowledge seeing as they needed "hey we can totally 100% prove none of this was stolen/looted we swear" documents for all of it.
Nobody agrees to a sanction of that magnitude without the truth being far worse than what they are letting on, I agree
Not surprising. They're bible thumpers through and through. Makes sense they're doing this.
...not following your logic. Sounds more like unjustified religion-bashing/intolerance to me.
Bible Thumpers: Someone perceived as aggressively imposing their Christian beliefs upon others.
Pro Anti-Contraceptives and Anti-Abortion: http://www.cnn.com/2014/07/02/politics/scotus-hobby-lobby-impacts/index.html
They discriminate against women who use birth control: http://www.kansascity.com/living/liv-columns-blogs/jenee-osterheldt/article649972.html
They give huge donations to right wing anti gay campaigns: http://www.salon.com/2014/03/27/hobby_lobbys_secret_agenda_how_its_secretly_funding_a_vast_right_wing_movement/
Seriously it's been in the news several times these people are shoving their beliefs down the throats of their employees. Google it if you don't believe me. They're vile people.
I'm fine with other religions and I don't bash people for their beliefs. I bash them because they shove their beliefs down other peoples throats. I have a bible thumper in the family. I've delt with her bull for years. So long as you don't force your beliefs on another person, you're fine in my book.
Not surprising. They're bible thumpers through and through. Makes sense they're doing this.
...not following your logic. Sounds more like unjustified religion-bashing/intolerance to me.
Bible Thumpers: Someone perceived as aggressively imposing their Christian beliefs upon others.
Pro Anti-Contraceptives and Anti-Abortion: http://www.cnn.com/2014/07/02/pol...
They discriminate against women who use birth control: http://www.kansascity.com/living/liv-columns-blogs/jenee-ost...
They give huge donations to right wing anti gay campaigns: http://www.salon.com/2014/03/27/hobby_lobbys_secret_agenda_h...
Seriously it's been in the news several times these people are shoving their beliefs down the throats of their employees. Google it if you don't believe me. They're vile people.
I'm fine with other religions and I don't bash people for their beliefs. I bash them because they shove their beliefs down other peoples throats. I have a bible thumper in the family. I've delt with her bull for years. So long as you don't force your beliefs on another person, you're fine in my book.
Even your response indicates your bias. Newsflash: you don't have to be religious to be anti-abortion (as much as even religious types invoke their religion to support their belief). I'm neither religious nor Conservative/Republican and I oppose most forms of abortion on the logic that birth is an entirely arbitrary line for determining when a human being is legally considered a protected human life.
Also, it's not so much forcing their religion on other people than it is having a right to run their business in a way that conforms to Christian values. You have it completely backwards thanks to the way politics has portrayed it: the people who work for them CHOOSE to work for a Christian company with certain Christian values and policies. Forcing them to adopt your dogma on behalf of some of their willing employees is forcing your political dogma on them.
Your bias is showing.
Not surprising. They're bible thumpers through and through. Makes sense they're doing this.
...not following your logic. Sounds more like unjustified religion-bashing/intolerance to me.
Bible Thumpers: Someone perceived as aggressively imposing their Christian beliefs upon others.
Pro Anti-Contraceptives and Anti-Abortion: http://www.cnn.com/2014/07/02/politics/scotus-hobby-lobby-im...
They discriminate against women who use birth control: http://www.kansascity.com/living/liv-columns-blogs/jenee-ost...
They give huge donations to right wing anti gay campaigns: http://www.salon.com/2014/03/27/hobby_lobbys_secret_agenda_h...
Seriously it's been in the news several times these people are shoving their beliefs down the throats of their employees. Google it if you don't believe me. They're vile people.
I'm fine with other religions and I don't bash people for their beliefs. I bash them because they shove their beliefs down other peoples throats. I have a bible thumper in the family. I've delt with her bull for years. So long as you don't force your beliefs on another person, you're fine in my book.
Even your response indicates your bias. Newsflash: you don't have to be religious to be anti-abortion (as much as even religious types invoke their religion to support their belief). I'm neither religious nor Conservative/Republican and I oppose most forms of abortion on the logic that birth is an entirely arbitrary line for determining when a human being is legally considered a protected human life.
Also, it's not so much forcing their religion on other people than it is having a right to run their business in a way that conforms to Christian values. You have it completely backwards thanks to the way politics has portrayed it: the people who work for them CHOOSE to work for a Christian company with certain Christian values and policies. Forcing them to adopt your dogma on behalf of some of their willing employees is forcing your political dogma on them.
Your bias is showing.
Yes you don't have to be religious to be anti abortion but the religious bible thumpers tend to make up most of the people who are pro life. It's a given. They think it's killing children, even if you have an abortion early on. But I don't want to get into an abortion arguement here.
Or they could be just teens at their first job, not reading the legal mumbo jumbo and then suddenly they get knocked up, need an abortion and whoops, it's not covered. I doubt everyone who works for them knows that their working for a very strict religious company.
Plus they do discriminate against women and gays. That's been proven. If we lived in the 1950s I'd expect that, but we're in 2017. And they STILL discriminate against women?
I'm bias against discriminating against women and gays. So yeah my bias is showing.
Not surprising. They're bible thumpers through and through. Makes sense they're doing this.
What does that have to do with anything?
It could be that Astor's area is infested with the same type of religious residents that mine is. I would say many or most, but I'll go with the most visible/vocal "religious" folks in my area (deep in the Bible Belt) will preach at, belittle, etc. others but don't actually follow any of the teachings of their particular tennet. They put in what's essentially face time at Church every Sunday but are in reality total garbage human beings who don't even try to follow any of the teachings that they're receiving each and every week all the while extoling upon anyone they deem unworthy or heathenlike how pious and awesome they are when they're anything but. Hobby Lobby (well, the private owners/controllers anyway) has a bit of the same issue where they've gone to great lengths to show how pious and "humble" they are but actually act quite the opposite. Proverbially getting their hands caught in the cookie jar in this instance (basically buying up artifacts which somehow lift up their religious beliefs that everyone warned them about being stolen then getting caught at it) isn't too shocking. Astor was just (more than a little) indelicate in expressing that lack of surprise.
Well, I hate to break it to you, but you aren't handling it much better. "Infested?" Come on now. That's the same bigoted intolerance I was calling Astor out on.
Here's the thing about hypocrites:
They may not be as good as the truly faithful and they may not live up to even their own self-imposed standards that they annoyingly seek to impose on everyone else, but even the hypocrites aren't all cartoon character villains. That's the same problem I had with the V for Vendetta movie: the message was so forced that they didn't just expose the hypocrites, they turned them into even worse cartoon character villains who are a million times worse than everyone else.
You aren't winning and hearts or changing any minds with that kind of blatant demonization. Most of the people complaining about Christians "forcing their beliefs" can't even recall the last time a Christian tried to force them to listen and will usually point to something like a prayer at a public event.
Those "nasty" Christians! Forcing you to see a public display of their faith! Right? Right?
Those "nasty" Christians! Forcing you to see a public display of their faith! Right? Right?
And if they do, just run over said display with a car.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/28/us/arkansas-ten-commandments-monument.html
Considering ancient relics in the middle east keep getting bombed to hell I'd say the relics were safer here. Iraq couldn't even keep their own museums from being looted.
That's been one of the debates in the past.
The problem is once the country stabilizes, they have a bitch of a time getting their rightful artifacts back. Egypt had that struggle with a lot of European museums.