Is the SNES a realible console? So worried about reliability
Lately, I've been looking up SNES videos on YouTube and i seen many broken SNES videos such as them glitching, freezing or crashing.
What could cause CPU or PPU failure?
I have two SHVC-CPU-01 consoles working.
One is a 1/1/1 model and the other is a 2/1/3 model.
All work great but i'm worried about the chips failing in them.
Is the SHVC 1/1/1 and 2/1/3 model a bad version to have.
Even though the ver. 1 cpu is known for a DMA bug that causes the SNES to crash, It never crashed on me. Please let me know. And yes i'm using the correct power supply which i'm using the SNS-002 Power adpater.
What could cause CPU or PPU failure?
I have two SHVC-CPU-01 consoles working.
One is a 1/1/1 model and the other is a 2/1/3 model.
All work great but i'm worried about the chips failing in them.
Is the SHVC 1/1/1 and 2/1/3 model a bad version to have.
Even though the ver. 1 cpu is known for a DMA bug that causes the SNES to crash, It never crashed on me. Please let me know. And yes i'm using the correct power supply which i'm using the SNS-002 Power adpater.
Comments
I do have piles of defective SNES and SFC systems around and of the ones that failed without externally-inflicted damage (physical or electrical), they are almost all SHVC-CPU-01. I'd say more than 9 of 10 are that revision. It makes sense that the earlier revisions might be the most problematic. While I've seen a lot over the years with failed CPU, PPU1, and PPU2 chips, they could've been failed since the mid '90s for all I know. The more recent threat to those boards seems to be the the RF-only issue.
I don't know what causes it though I've been investigating for a while. The AV Multi-out is either scrambled or blank leading many people to assume that the console is dead. I've traced the composite signal from the encoder to the Multi-out and RF modulator. There's nothing between the two to explain why the same composite signal works for the RF modulator and not the AV multi-out so it must simply be that the modulator and TV tuner is more tolerant of whatever has gone wrong with the signal. I tried swapping between encoder chips with known-good chips (S-ENC and the BA-whatever) and the issue persisted.
Lately, I've been looking up SNES videos on YouTube and i seen many broken SNES videos such as them glitching, freezing or crashing.
What could cause CPU or PPU failure?
I have two SHVC-CPU-01 consoles working.
One is a 1/1/1 model and the other is a 2/1/3 model.
All work great but i'm worried about the chips failing in them.
Is the SHVC 1/1/1 and 2/1/3 model a bad version to have.
Even though the ver. 1 cpu is known for a DMA bug that causes the SNES to crash, It never crashed on me. Please let me know. And yes i'm using the correct power supply which i'm using the SNS-002 Power adpater.
(quoted to make the font color easier to read). I have never had a Super Nintendo that had bad chips in it, or one fail on me. I haven't had a whole lot, but I've had around 10 since I started collecting and all were fine. I would be more worried about the capacitors in it. I would also be more worried about the fuse if anything, that is the point of failure that I have seen before.
Hate to say it, but those early SFC and SNES units are probably the most likely to go bad of any Nintendo home console. Failure rates on that dwarf any other Nintendo console, from what I've seen.
Edit: Has anyone ever tried S-Video or RGB output from SNES consoles that have composite broken on the multi-out? I'm curious if at least one or both types of those outputs still work. Also, the SHVC-CPU-01 SNES revision can be modified to output component video directly from the BA video chip fairly easily, and that's another type of video output I wonder would still work if composite is broken. Lastly, has anyone tried removing the RF modulators on these 'composite video broken' SNES consoles? For some reason I feel like the RF modulators have something to do with composite video failing on the multi-outs, it's really just a hunch though I'm probably dead wrong.
I've tried all of that... removing/switching the RF box, switching to a component-capable encoder, running S-Video/RGB, swapping to a known-good video amp transistor, etc. Best I can get is scrambled video.
Yikes. I guess I'll stick to a GPM-01 or GPM-02 as the oldest SNES revision I'll use then.
Oh man. What is wrong having an SHVC CPU 01? I have two that work perfectly and they never failed on me. I’m worried about reliability for this revision. Is it really a unreliable?
I have one also that works fine, along with a component video modded GPM-02. I bought it broken off of ebay for cheap (broken power jack is all it was) and fixed it myself, the video quality actually has slightly more vivid colors than my GPM-02 revision, but since there's hardly any space inside of it I'm not sure if I'll modify it to have component video also.
I think they are way beyond the point of being questioned for their reliability, they have been out 25+ years and the majority of them still function perfectly fine.
In general, yes, but there are far more dead SHVC-CPU-01 boards than, say, VA5/VA6 Sega Genesis/Megadrive.
I’d go as far as to say that it is the by far the most prone to spontaneous electronic failure product Nintendo has ever produced, at least for the mainstream. I consider the common Virtual Boy display and DSlite hinge issues to be more physical than electronic.
I think they are way beyond the point of being questioned for their reliability, they have been out 25+ years and the majority of them still function perfectly fine.
In general, yes, but there are far more dead SHVC-CPU-01 boards than, say, VA5/VA6 Sega Genesis/Megadrive.
I’d go as far as to say that it is the by far the most prone to spontaneous electronic failure product Nintendo has ever produced, at least for the mainstream. I consider the common Virtual Boy display and DSlite hinge issues to be more physical than electronic.
And it's unavoidable, you are buying an old video game console...
Buy it under the pretenses it works and hope for the best.
Oh man. What is wrong having an SHVC CPU 01? I have two that work perfectly and they never failed on me. I’m worried about reliability for this revision. Is it really a unreliable?
As far as I can tell, the chip failures that are going to happen happened long ago. Haven’t seen any sign that failures are increasing so if it’s lasted this long itMs probably going to keep going.
The RF-only problem is the only thing I’d be concerned about and even that is more about awareness. In other words, be aware and don’t assume that the blank screen means “CPU failure” if you do encounter it. Hopefully increasing awareness will lead to a fix.
Go buy a SNES and enjoy it.
As for the RF-only issue: I do believe that heat/humidity has something to do with it. One guy in Puerto Rico says he has 40-something of them with that problem! Just don't go throwing it into an attic, garage, storage unit, etc with climate control in case there is something to that. That's the only major precaution I'd suggest.
I think you've just been a victim to shit on youtube, this shit happens to less than 1% of them I'm sure.
Go buy a SNES and enjoy it.
He already has one and it’s a revision that has proven to be particularly prone to failure in the past. Check any lot of junk/broken SNES systems: Almost every one with a chip failure is a SHVC-CPU-01 board, as are the ones with the RF-only problem. That’s easily 90% of all spontaneously failed SNES/SFC consoles.
I didn’t get this from YouTube. I noticed trends right here on NintendoAge and then began researching it myself. There are two users here from Puerto Rico including DerpmiesterPR who’s system I still have as part of my investigation. I’ve ordered large lots of broken systems, like a pile of 12 SFCs from Japan. I’ve even identified a few of the RF-only systems for acquaintences around town who thought their console was dead. Most recently I helped that Peter G. guy identify the issue with an SNES he was working on (famous for making home consoles portable, like Ben Heck).
I’ve easily seen 80 of these systems. When it isn’t a blown fuse, bad caps, broken power jack, destroyed connector, etc and the only think left is a spontaneous chip failure or whatever causes the RF-only issue, it’s almost always the SHVC-CPU-01.
I definitely didn’t get this from YouTube and I’m actually a little miffed that you would flippantly dismiss my experience and research in the matter. Speaking of YouTube, I watched a video this morning of a guy unboxing and testing 6 junk SNES consoles. Sure enough, most were SHVC-CPU-01. The ones that weren’t either worked or had an obvious physical issue (missing ribbon cable connector; cracked board, etc).
I do want to spread word about the RF-only issue so people don’t throw out working systems. I’m not fear-mongering though. I don’t think the chip failures are something to worry about.
I actually had a broken SNES given to me around 1995 which I dug up over a year ago after I started noticing this trend. Sure enough: it was an SHVC-CPU-01 with a failed CPU. As far as I know ALL the chip failures happened early on, since I haven’t heard of any failing that way more recently (other than the RF-only issue being misdiagnosed). That’s why I’m saying not to worry about those unless we start to see/hear differently.
The Nintendo Super System arcade machine was based on SHVC-CPU-01 boards and it is well known for having the same chip failure issues. Check out the repair logs if you don’t believe me!
http://projectvb.com/nss/logs.htm
I think you've just been a victim to shit on youtube, this shit happens to less than 1% of them I'm sure.
Go buy a SNES and enjoy it.
He already has one and it’s a revision that has proven to be particularly prone to failure in the past. Check any lot of junk/broken SNES systems: Almost every one with a chip failure is a SHVC-CPU-01 board, as are the ones with the RF-only problem. That’s easily 90% of all spontaneously failed SNES/SFC consoles.
I didn’t get this from YouTube. I noticed trends right here on NintendoAge and then began researching it myself. There are two users here from Puerto Rico including DerpmiesterPR who’s system I still have as part of my investigation. I’ve ordered large lots of broken systems, like a pile of 12 SFCs from Japan. I’ve even identified a few of the RF-only systems for acquaintences around town who thought their console was dead. Most recently I helped that Peter G. guy identify the issue with an SNES he was working on (famous for making home consoles portable, like Ben Heck).
I’ve easily seen 80 of these systems. When it isn’t a blown fuse, bad caps, broken power jack, destroyed connector, etc and the only think left is a spontaneous chip failure or whatever causes the RF-only issue, it’s almost always the SHVC-CPU-01.
I definitely didn’t get this from YouTube and I’m actually a little miffed that you would flippantly dismiss my experience and research in the matter. Speaking of YouTube, I watched a video this morning of a guy unboxing and testing 6 junk SNES consoles. Sure enough, most were SHVC-CPU-01. The ones that weren’t either worked or had an obvious physical issue (missing ribbon cable connector; cracked board, etc).
I do want to spread word about the RF-only issue so people don’t throw out working systems. I’m not fear-mongering though. I don’t think the chip failures are something to worry about.
I actually had a broken SNES given to me around 1995 which I dug up over a year ago after I started noticing this trend. Sure enough: it was an SHVC-CPU-01 with a failed CPU. As far as I know ALL the chip failures happened early on, since I haven’t heard of any failing that way more recently (other than the RF-only issue being misdiagnosed). That’s why I’m saying not to worry about those unless we start to see/hear differently.
The Nintendo Super System arcade machine was based on SHVC-CPU-01 boards and it is well known for having the same chip failure issues. Check out the repair logs if you don’t believe me!
http://projectvb.com/nss/logs.htm
Comment wasn't directed at you bhed.
Keep up the good research though you are doing Gods work.
(just a snippet)
Sorry, Steve.
That's in the "Retro Console Modders Mods and Repairs" FB group. If I can't figure it out I'm hoping someone else there does so I try not to miss an opportunity to bring it up.
Thanks, Toxie.
Hey guys, Please forgive me, I do have two working SHVC CPU 01's that work. I was just worried about their chips failing.
Best guess is that you'll be fine.
https://forum.digitpress.com/forum/showthread.php?175602-SNES-Generation-1-Video-Problems-50-Units-with-same-defect-RF-Works-Fine-RCA-Output-BAD&p=2052442#post2052442
Found this cool post at the bottom,might have a snes I could try this out on.
https://forum.digitpress.com/foru...
Sweet! That’s a super-recent post too. I wonder if that’s Peter G from the same FB group (recently said he’d look into it). I can’t wait to try this! Still curious to know what has failed. Based on the way it gradually fails and is better tolerated by RF, I figured it was a jittery sync issue that might be fixed by the dejitter mod from Marqs and Borti (if it’s still within what they can handle).
I’d like to restore full RGB, composite, and S-Video so I will try swapping PPU2 with a known-good system to see if that changes anything.
My theory about these consoles is the fuse is of poorer quality than those used in later models. The design is unique to any other video game motherboard I have seen. It's possible the fuse / machine method was cheapened and done quicker to meet the demands of sales in the first few years. So my theory is the fuse is of shit quality, that sends bad electric signals to the mobo and chip sets which in turn causes them problems which are permanent. I replaced a fuse on a NO Video set and it did make the console start with video, but with scrambled graphics. So it kind of supports my theory.
So what about all those CPU-01 systems that work now? Luck? Possibly. We could document the weld and fuses. We can make a list of all serial numbers to see if we can create a breakpoint, that would take a large community. In the end to those of us that care, Nintendo would NEVER admit any fault and it would take alot of effort now to find a root cause. My advice to those with working systems is to soft set the power switch when unplugging the unit to store on a shelf or back in it's original box. You'll see the power light flicker when the console is unplugged.
Originally posted by: CZroe
Originally posted by: Pikkon
Found this cool post at the bottom,might have a snes I could try this out on.
https://forum.digitpress.com/forum/showthread.php?175602-SNE...
Sweet! That’s a super-recent post too. I wonder if that’s Peter G from the same FB group (recently said he’d look into it). I can’t wait to try this! Still curious to know what has failed. Based on the way it gradually fails and is better tolerated by RF, I figured it was a jittery sync issue that might be fixed by the dejitter mod from Marqs and Borti (if it’s still within what they can handle).
I’d like to restore full RGB, composite, and S-Video so I will try swapping PPU2 with a known-good system to see if that changes anything.
I have a super fami that with composite and s-video will only display in black and white,swapping out the video encoder did nothing but rgb and component work just fine in color so hopefully this little mode will work.
I've logged 19 Super Nintendo consoles as "No Video / Erratic noise at startup" and I have 7 with messed up graphics. One of those 7 was my original from 1992. So with that being said, I can confirm this is NOT caused by third party adapters. I didn't see anyone call that out, I just want to throw that out there. I never used a third party adapter, I never stored my console in extreme temperatures so that isn't the root cause. Out of the 26 failed consoles they are all of course CPU-01 models, except for one. I have one SNS-CPU-GPM-02 that has no video. I have not tried the RF unit on most of these, so I may dig a few to check if they will work with the RF unit.
My theory about these consoles is the fuse is of poorer quality than those used in later models. The design is unique to any other video game motherboard I have seen. It's possible the fuse / machine method was cheapened and done quicker to meet the demands of sales in the first few years. So my theory is the fuse is of shit quality, that sends bad electric signals to the mobo and chip sets which in turn causes them problems which are permanent. I replaced a fuse on a NO Video set and it did make the console start with video, but with scrambled graphics. So it kind of supports my theory.
So what about all those CPU-01 systems that work now? Luck? Possibly. We could document the weld and fuses. We can make a list of all serial numbers to see if we can create a breakpoint, that would take a large community. In the end to those of us that care, Nintendo would NEVER admit any fault and it would take alot of effort now to find a root cause. My advice to those with working systems is to soft set the power switch when unplugging the unit to store on a shelf or back in it's original box. You'll see the power light flicker when the console is unplugged.
Good to know. Are you familiar enough with any of the failed consoles to know around when they failed?
Found this cool post at the bottom,might have a snes I could try this out on.
https://forum.digitpress.com/forum/showthread.php?175602-SNE...
Sweet! That’s a super-recent post too. I wonder if that’s Peter G from the same FB group (recently said he’d look into it). I can’t wait to try this! Still curious to know what has failed. Based on the way it gradually fails and is better tolerated by RF, I figured it was a jittery sync issue that might be fixed by the dejitter mod from Marqs and Borti (if it’s still within what they can handle).
I’d like to restore full RGB, composite, and S-Video so I will try swapping PPU2 with a known-good system to see if that changes anything.
I have a super fami that with composite and s-video will only display in black and white,swapping out the video encoder did nothing but rgb and component work just fine in color so hopefully this little mode will work.
https://youtu.be/9gNHo9VLBro
https://youtu.be/2eUk-f1W_Fo
I had an NES with that same problem but, of course, it was internal to the PPU. Worked fine with Hi-Def NES since it essentially replicates the PPU function (digital video is not externally accessible). GameTechUS has a toploader with a similar problem but it also had a bad CPU and the voltage was wrong when he used a particular DC polarity (NES normally supports either polarity, since it even takes AC). Neither of those appeared to be the case for my B&W only NES.
Looking at the schematic I can see where Luma from pin 23 gets amplified (Q11), branches off, and goes right back into the encoder... presumably to be combined internally with Chroma for the composite output. This is also where Q11 amplifies Luma for the multi-out. I tried swapping Q10 (composite amp) with a known-good part but I don’t think I tried swapping Q11. A problem there could possibly feed back into the other signals derived from it (RF/composite).