Gs bench isnt near the same as it was. Team was actually rather thin this season. It was their weakness this year.
Their playoffs starting lineup included what: Durant, Thompson, Curry, Green, and Cousins? That's not just a "big 3"...when that team clicked it was like NBA jam. What other teams in history were THIS stacked?
That still leaves Looney, Iggy, Livingston, Cook, and McKinnie...all solid contributors. C'mon that's a deep bench, Looney, Iggy, and Cook would probably be starters on other teams. I'm genuinely curious what other teams were stacked this high this year...Houston might have been close?
I'll give the Raptors credit for taking out a Giannis led Bucks team (that the League showed a blatantly obvious bias towards). Well done.
As for the Finals, nah. Minimal credit due. They faced a shell of a team trying to band-aid lineups together. And it STILL took them 6 games (would have been 7 if Steph hit that last shot).
Actually, it was really close to a sweep...had Iggy not made that 3 at the end of game 2 who knows.
I'll give the Raptors credit for taking out a Giannis led Bucks team (that the League showed a blatantly obvious bias towards). Well done.
As for the Finals, nah. Minimal credit due. They faced a shell of a team trying to band-aid lineups together. And it STILL took them 6 games (would have been 7 if Steph hit that last shot).
I was going to bring that up, but didnt want to sound like a butt hurt Dubs fan. Glad you said it!
Gs bench isnt near the same as it was. Team was actually rather thin this season. It was their weakness this year.
Their playoffs starting lineup included what: Durant, Thompson, Curry, Green, and Cousins? That's not just a "big 3"...when that team clicked it was like NBA jam. What other teams in history were THIS stacked?
That still leaves Looney, Iggy, Livingston, Cook, and McKinnie...all solid contributors. C'mon that's a deep bench, Looney, Iggy, and Cook would probably be starters on other teams. I'm genuinely curious what other teams were stacked this high this year...Houston might have been close?
Iguodala isnt near the same player. Livingston is done. Hes on the verge of retiring. Looney was hurt all series. Iggy was actually playing hurt as well. Cook is nothing. Mckinnie is just another player. Hes not special. Bell was overhyped basically barely playable. Jerebko is unplayable defender. Their bench is no longer deep. It was their weakness. This was discussed all playoffs. They had to find minutes due to injuries. You are thinking of iggy and livingston 2-3 years ago. They arent the same. Their bench got worse because of the starters they extended and signed.
^ Pretty much nailed that Quest. Livingston & Iggy have lost a couple steps, and Cook is just ok. I do like Jerebko though. I feel he should've been getting the most bench minutes all season. His D is marginal, but he's a solid all around player.
Gs bench isnt near the same as it was. Team was actually rather thin this season. It was their weakness this year.
Their playoffs starting lineup included what: Durant, Thompson, Curry, Green, and Cousins? That's not just a "big 3"...when that team clicked it was like NBA jam. What other teams in history were THIS stacked?
That still leaves Looney, Iggy, Livingston, Cook, and McKinnie...all solid contributors. C'mon that's a deep bench, Looney, Iggy, and Cook would probably be starters on other teams. I'm genuinely curious what other teams were stacked this high this year...Houston might have been close?
Iguodala isnt near the same player. Livingston is done. Hes on the verge of retiring. Looney was hurt all series. Iggy was actually playing hurt as well. Cook is nothing. Mckinnie is just another player. Hes not special. Bell was overhyped basically barely playable. Jerebko is unplayable defender. Their bench is no longer deep. It was their weakness. This was discussed all playoffs. They had to find minutes due to injuries. You are thinking of iggy and livingston 2-3 years ago. They arent the same. Their bench got worse because of the starters they extended and signed.
Fair enough, I do think that Iggy could still start somewhere else though - while his stats might not show it, he makes plays happen and has a high basketball IQ. But then again I think he missed back to back free throws too last game lol. Looney is starter quality, and Cook will be if he isn't already.
I still don't hear any mentions of other teams that have a stronger roster though...
All I'm saying is that the Raptors earned it 100% and deserve the credit, considering the offseason moves they made and wow, what a year. Wish the Drake crap would take a backseat though. Now that free agency has taken a nosedive, I wonder if Kawhi will be tempted to dip out.
Gs bench isnt near the same as it was. Team was actually rather thin this season. It was their weakness this year.
Their playoffs starting lineup included what: Durant, Thompson, Curry, Green, and Cousins? That's not just a "big 3"...when that team clicked it was like NBA jam. What other teams in history were THIS stacked?
That still leaves Looney, Iggy, Livingston, Cook, and McKinnie...all solid contributors. C'mon that's a deep bench, Looney, Iggy, and Cook would probably be starters on other teams. I'm genuinely curious what other teams were stacked this high this year...Houston might have been close?
Iguodala isnt near the same player. Livingston is done. Hes on the verge of retiring. Looney was hurt all series. Iggy was actually playing hurt as well. Cook is nothing. Mckinnie is just another player. Hes not special. Bell was overhyped basically barely playable. Jerebko is unplayable defender. Their bench is no longer deep. It was their weakness. This was discussed all playoffs. They had to find minutes due to injuries. You are thinking of iggy and livingston 2-3 years ago. They arent the same. Their bench got worse because of the starters they extended and signed.
Fair enough, I do think that Iggy could still start somewhere else though - while his stats might not show it, he makes plays happen and has a high basketball IQ. But then again I think he missed back to back free throws too last game lol. Looney is starter quality, and Cook will be if he isn't already.
I still don't hear any mentions of other teams that have a stronger roster though...
All I'm saying is that the Raptors earned it 100% and deserve the credit, considering the offseason moves they made and wow, what a year. Wish the Drake crap would take a backseat though. Now that free agency has taken a nosedive, I wonder if Kawhi will be tempted to dip out.
Other teams dont have a stronger roster because no one has 5 freaking allstar starters.
Raptors deserve credit. But there is an asterisk to me. They beat a banged up warriors team. Just like the warriors got an asterisk when they beat the no love, kyrie cavs.
I also said originally if you look at this chain. Their bench was way thinner than in the past. And you came back at me with their starting 5. That wasnt what I was talking about
Gs bench isnt near the same as it was. Team was actually rather thin this season. It was their weakness this year.
Their playoffs starting lineup included what: Durant, Thompson, Curry, Green, and Cousins? That's not just a "big 3"...when that team clicked it was like NBA jam. What other teams in history were THIS stacked?
That still leaves Looney, Iggy, Livingston, Cook, and McKinnie...all solid contributors. C'mon that's a deep bench, Looney, Iggy, and Cook would probably be starters on other teams. I'm genuinely curious what other teams were stacked this high this year...Houston might have been close?
Iguodala isnt near the same player. Livingston is done. Hes on the verge of retiring. Looney was hurt all series. Iggy was actually playing hurt as well. Cook is nothing. Mckinnie is just another player. Hes not special. Bell was overhyped basically barely playable. Jerebko is unplayable defender. Their bench is no longer deep. It was their weakness. This was discussed all playoffs. They had to find minutes due to injuries. You are thinking of iggy and livingston 2-3 years ago. They arent the same. Their bench got worse because of the starters they extended and signed.
Iggy was playing lockdown defense all postseason and just hung 22 last night. I think he's still a stud player.
I'll give the Raptors credit for taking out a Giannis led Bucks team (that the League showed a blatantly obvious bias towards). Well done.
As for the Finals, nah. Minimal credit due. They faced a shell of a team trying to band-aid lineups together. And it STILL took them 6 games (would have been 7 if Steph hit that last shot).
I was going to bring that up, but didnt want to sound like a butt hurt Dubs fan. Glad you said it!
So I guess the warriors get minimal credit for beating basically just LeBron in 2015 and again in 2018?
Gs bench isnt near the same as it was. Team was actually rather thin this season. It was their weakness this year.
Their playoffs starting lineup included what: Durant, Thompson, Curry, Green, and Cousins? That's not just a "big 3"...when that team clicked it was like NBA jam. What other teams in history were THIS stacked?
That still leaves Looney, Iggy, Livingston, Cook, and McKinnie...all solid contributors. C'mon that's a deep bench, Looney, Iggy, and Cook would probably be starters on other teams. I'm genuinely curious what other teams were stacked this high this year...Houston might have been close?
Iguodala isnt near the same player. Livingston is done. Hes on the verge of retiring. Looney was hurt all series. Iggy was actually playing hurt as well. Cook is nothing. Mckinnie is just another player. Hes not special. Bell was overhyped basically barely playable. Jerebko is unplayable defender. Their bench is no longer deep. It was their weakness. This was discussed all playoffs. They had to find minutes due to injuries. You are thinking of iggy and livingston 2-3 years ago. They arent the same. Their bench got worse because of the starters they extended and signed.
Iggy was playing lockdown defense all postseason and just hung 22 last night. I think he's still a stud player.
If he had to play that much impact an entire season he wears down. They rest him a ton during the year. Hes old. Of course in an elimination game hes going all out. Again thats their best player off the bench. When they dont have their starter rotation, they are exposed. Cousins couldnt play big minutes. Klay missed 1.5 games. Durant played 12 minutes. Iguodala is a pretty good player. But hes also the best of their bench. After him there is no one really impactful.
Whelp.... now is as good a time as any to chime in.
I've been perusing this thread since the beginning and patiently watching, and waiting.... and waiting....
There was barely ANYBODY that gave The Raptors any respect, let alone to say they had a shot at winning it!
Hahaha.... NO ONE gave them any respect to get through The 6ers, or The Bucks. Nevermind get to the finals... or... WIN IT ALL!!!!
The Raptors played through adversity all year long with different line ups and roster changes and media questioning a first year coach and something strange called "load management". All the while they stayed consistent on the floor and the entire roster "bought in".
THE RAPTORS DESERVE RESPECT. They proved it all year, and it came to fruition with an NBA Championship.
Battled through adversity in EVERY round of the playoffs.
Wrote off after the first game against a hot Orlando Magic. They were done...
Back against the wall vs. Philly but they fought back and a shot that was bouncing on the rim for 18 years finally went down.
Down 2 games against the Bucks, it was going to be a SWEEP!!!! But Marc Gasol and other key players shut down Giannis and the Raps prevailed.
Then it was once again going to be a sweep against the Warriors. How could the mighty Warriors lose to a first time finals team???
Well.... IT HAPPENED. An even battle against a team that is a genuine dynasty. 3 titles in 5 years. 5 straight championship appearances, 2 championships in a row coming into 2019. Nick Nurse, the medical staff, and every player on the roster were able to come together to beat that team.
THE BETTER TEAM WON. Every series, and almost every game, a different person stepped up to help the Raps win.
CANADA IS THE NBA CHAMPION. That is an incredible thing. Canada is the NBA Champions....? However we want to butcher the english language.... RAPS ARE CHAMPS.
Now to the meaningless sideshow:
Achilles: KD should not have been playing, that's on the Warriors medical/management staff. Some raps fans were dicks (guy waving) yes, but it's not like buddy is thinking "Oh Kevin Durant is hurt, that is shitty for him" he's thinking "great, he's a really good player who won't be no the court anymore." Dick move, yes, but not malicious I wouldn't say. And literally 5s later the fans cheered KD off the court and chanted "KD". Just a media circus to distract from the fact that he shouldn't have been playing and the Warriors medical staff knew that. They said it was a "calf" but Leo Rautins, and others, said it was probably an achilles and he shouldn't return but he was getting pressure from the organization. Unfortunate, yes, but that's part of the game. It's not why the Raps won, or would have lost. Raps were banged up too. Lowry will have surgery this off season, and a lot of key bench players were out.
"Injuries": If anyone wants to bring up "injuries" as an argument for one team winning over the other, I will simply point out "load management". The Raptors literally managed how much load they were putting on Kawhi Leanard and specifically an injured thigh, and look what happened. He was able to play the majority of the regular season and dominate in the playoffs. Of course Thompson's injury was freak, but for KD, camman... there's no way he should have been on the court. Injuries happen both ways, it's not a reason this series was won by The Raptors)
Tell me that having two of the best three point shooters in the game surrrounded by All-Stars isn't good enough to beat the Raps? Had that been the case STILL no one would have given them a shot.
Either way, KD playing, Thompson playing, Lowry needing thumb surgery.... THE RAPTORS team beat The Warriors. They were the better team.
^ It's super easy to analyze everything after all is said and done.
Even so, your statement that injuries played no role in the outcome is silly. The injuries to KD and Thompson absolutely impacted the way the series was played.
That said, I had no preference on who won. So congrats to the Raptors.
^ It's super easy to analyze everything after all is said and done.
Even so, your statement that injuries played no role in the outcome is silly. The injuries to KD and Thompson absolutely impacted the way the series was played.
That said, I had no preference on who won. So congrats to the Raptors.
^ It's super easy to analyze everything after all is said and done.
Even so, your statement that injuries played no role in the outcome is silly. The injuries to KD and Thompson absolutely impacted the way the series was played.
That said, I had no preference on who won. So congrats to the Raptors.
I agree. It's silly and complete nonsense.
I could have easily made each of those main points about each series as they went on.
It's easy to say that injuries played a role in the outcome. Because the team you expected to win, lost. And one (then two) of their best players were injured. But you do realize that if KD played, they would have still have had to win 4 games, right? So, even after the Raps WIN a title, you're assuming they would have lost because of 1, then 2, players were not playing.
Doesn't matter who is on the court, you still need to play better as a team and win four games.
Does anybody talk about the fact that KD had to jump ship from his own team to join a winning team just to get a title? No one cares about that anymore.
Raps did it with a bunch of "nobodies" and still beat the Splash Brothers. Something that Lebron James and the Clevleand Cavaliers couldn't do in 2016. So you can make these arguments either way. Warriors have the two best three opint shooters in the NBA, Curry is on pace to be the greatest ever both in % and 3's made, Draymond Green, Igoudala, and Cousins..... so that's not enough?
If someone said "Can the Raps beat the Warriors without KD?" you'd have said no, EVERYONE on these boards said Raps didn't stand a chance! Haha...
Fact is, Raptors could have won if the Warriors did or didn't have KD. Injuries are a part of the game. They should have had better bench players then. That's on the GM.
Making the argument that team X only won because team Y had injuries is what's silly. There's been years where the Warrriors won when players on the other teams were injured..... sssssooooo.... is anyone taking away from those victories?
Raps won. Not Lowry, not Leanard.... KD didn't lose, Curry didn't lose. RAPTORS WON, AND WARRIORS LOST.
Simple.
Edit:
And no one is talking about Raps injuries.... Lowry's thumb is damn near falling off and Kawhi is limping around. Van Vleet got his face smashed in. Again, bench mob was hurt/out for the playoffs.
Houston didnt take advantage of no durant. I was dissapointed. Toronto got a few more gifts and took advantage. Did exactly what they were supposed to do. Toronto has a good team.
You think Id give a damn if the Rockets beat Golden States D League if it was all thats left. Id take it and celebrate. All we are saying is they lost 2 gigantic pieces and the rest were hobbled like a few raptors might have been. It played a role. Especially with all the close played games. One of the best shooters on the planet and arguably the best player on the planet didnt play. It matters.
Houston didnt take advantage of no durant. I was dissapointed. Toronto got a few more gifts and took advantage. Did exactly what they were supposed to do. Toronto has a good team.
You think Id give a damn if the Rockets beat Golden States D League was all thats left. Id take it and celebrate. All we are saying is they lost 2 gigantic pieces and the rest were hobbled like a few raptors might have been. It played a role. Especially with all the close played games. One of the best shooters on the planet and arguably the best player on the planet didnt play. It matters.
I am chill.
Actually.... it doesn't matter. Toronto Raptors are your 2019 NBA Champions. That's what matters.
What I find funny is that people thinking that it actually matters (injuries, players playing or not playing, minutes, crowds cheering, blah, blah, blah) when they're just trying to come up with other things to talk about, and not giving The Raptors the proper respect they deserve.
The Raptors WON the NBA Title, the Warriors didn't lose it.
You need to chill and give The Raptors the proper respect they deserve.
GS's been to the Finals 5 years in a row, everyone shat on them when Durant joined yet now.... god forbid the Raps beat the mighty warriors, haha.
GS won without him (KD) and won with him. It can be done both ways. GS also won NBA titles while other players were injured, it happens both ways. That's why arguing one way or the other is pointless.
Raps won this series. That's it.
Edit: This is exactly why I didn't get involved in this thread during the playoffs.
I didn't want to waste my energy on this stupid shit.
Imagine me having to sit here and say "Just wait... down 2-0 to the Bucks, got to take it one game at a time." Haha... it would be hell on earth having to deal with this.
But alas... The Raptors prevail.
Major respect to all the other teams. It wasn't easy for the Raptors. Beating the defending champs (no matter what) is no small task.
Houston didnt take advantage of no durant. I was dissapointed. Toronto got a few more gifts and took advantage. Did exactly what they were supposed to do. Toronto has a good team.
You think Id give a damn if the Rockets beat Golden States D League was all thats left. Id take it and celebrate. All we are saying is they lost 2 gigantic pieces and the rest were hobbled like a few raptors might have been. It played a role. Especially with all the close played games. One of the best shooters on the planet and arguably the best player on the planet didnt play. It matters.
I am chill.
Actually.... it doesn't matter. Toronto Raptors are your 2019 NBA Champions. That's what matters.
What I find funny is that people thinking that it actually matters (injuries, players playing or not playing, minutes, crowds cheering, blah, blah, blah) when they're just trying to come up with other things to talk about, and not giving The Raptors the proper respect they deserve.
The Raptors WON the NBA Title, the Warriors didn't lose it.
You need to chill and give The Raptors the proper respect they deserve.
GS's been to the Finals 5 years in a row, everyone shat on them when Durant joined yet now.... god forbid the Raps beat the mighty warriors, haha.
GS won without him (KD) and won with him. It can be done both ways. GS also won NBA titles while other players were injured, it happens both ways. That's why arguing one way or the other is pointless.
Raps won this series. That's it.
Edit: This is exactly why I didn't get involved in this thread during the playoffs.
I didn't want to waste my energy on this stupid shit.
Imagine me having to sit here and say "Just wait... down 2-0 to the Bucks, got to take it one game at a time." Haha... it would be hell on earth having to deal with this.
But alas... The Raptors prevail.
Major respect to all the other teams. It wasn't easy for the Raptors. Beating the defending champs (no matter what) is no small task.
I guess you dont want to actually reading anything I said. I even said just like when the warriors beat the cavs without love or kyrie.
I said the raptors are a good team and did what they were supposed to do.
What do you want us to say? BOW DOWN TO THE MIGHTY RAPTORS. Jesus, I hate the warriors with a passion, but cmon man.
I have no doubt that if KD and Klay were both healthy the warriors would have won. I don't really care though because it's stupid that this team even has KD after 73-9. It was still a weakass move by KD. I'm just glad the team that took the easy road didn't win this time.
The biggest loser in this series is by far boogie, who probably lost at least $25 million this year to get carried to a ring and got nothing. RIP.
GS lost all of there home games. Two of them they just got outplayed, the third Klay went down. They were down KD yes, even so GS still has the better roster.
Toronto straight outplayed GS and took the championship. The only blemish for Toronto was game 5.
GS got outplayed, out willed even out coached. Everything else is just X factors and that's the way shit goes.
That is some straight bandwagon shit lol. I was wondering who the first to show up was gonna be.
Trying to act like the injuries made no difference is crazy.
Drake is a clown too, doing post game interviews and shit. Straight up grown male cheerleader. Cant wait to see his raptors tattoo.
And at Americansteam7-
Yes, their wins againts the cavs with no love and kyrie is the same level.
In the end a championship is a championship. Canada can enjoy their trophy, their teams never win anything else.
Hahaha, bandwagon.... Dude, I've been watching The Raptors since I was 12 (Grew up in Ontario). Been to many games at the (then) ACC, saw them in Edmonton when I lived in Alberta, and got a shout-out from Chuck Swirsky on a live game ~10 years ago... bandwagon, haha...
And I'm stoked for all the people who DID jump on the bandwagon. Almost 1/2 of Canada watched the final game at some point. I'm okay with that.
To Quest, and everyone, I'd like to make something clear:
You are 100% correct that adding/subracting a player would "make a difference" to a game. However, my point is that saying injuries makes a difference is:
1) A weak argument because of how simple it is to say "a player would make a difference" and that you could literally say it about any player and you would be right simply by the definition of "difference".
2) It disregards a teams gameplay and assumes the other team (with the injuries) would have won. Which, isn't true. Both teams still would have needed to win 4 no matter who is on the court.
I think it's the same without Kyrie or Love. Warrriors won, end of story, there are no asterisks, they were the better team.... and the reason for that is because it's not Kyrie, Love, or KD that win a title... it's the team. One player can't win a game in basketball. So saying "it would have made a difference" is a poor argument because there are so many variables. It's the organization's job to get their players into the playoffs healthy.
Hahaha, is that last one supposed to be a dig? Who cares? USA has 10x the population, and in most sports Canada only has a couple teams.
NHL 6-30 something teams? MLB 1- I have no idea how many teams, NFL - 0, NBA - 1-30 teams....???
Of course, the NBA only has one Canadian team. The Raptors. Not sure if you knew that.
That would leave odds in favour of the American teams. Prettty simple, haha. Plus... we do okay at the Winter Olympics!
Originally posted by: quest4nes
I guess you dont want to actually reading anything I said. I even said just like when the warriors beat the cavs without love or kyrie.
I said the raptors are a good team and did what they were supposed to do.
What do you want us to say? BOW DOWN TO THE MIGHTY RAPTORS. Jesus, I hate the warriors with a passion, but cmon man.
Yeah, so The Raps get an asterisk *KD was hurt? Haha, that sucks...
Yes
Originally posted by: psychobear85
GS lost to 1 top guy and a bunch of role players, Kevin Durant aside they still had Curry, Green and Thomson (for the most part) and an older Igudala with a some what game Cousins. Still a had them shooters. People need to stop being salty and give credit where credit is due.
Originally posted by: skinnygrinny
GS lost all of there home games. Two of them they just got outplayed, the third Klay went down. They were down KD yes, even so GS still has the better roster.
Toronto straight outplayed GS and took the championship. The only blemish for Toronto was game 5.
GS got outplayed, out willed even out coached. Everything else is just X factors and that's the way shit goes.
Toronto 2019 NBA champs no ifs ands or buts.
All of this. Roll this all up into one big sentence and you got the truth.
Other teams dont have a stronger roster because no one has 5 freaking allstar starters.
Raptors deserve credit. But there is an asterisk to me. They beat a banged up warriors team. Just like the warriors got an asterisk when they beat the no love, kyrie cavs.
I also said originally if you look at this chain. Their bench was way thinner than in the past. And you came back at me with their starting 5. That wasnt what I was talking about
For someone that literally just talked shit in this thread that other people didn't read what you typed...you clearly didn't read that I listed their starting 5 AND 5 solid contributors from the bench. Three of which I feel are starter quality.
Jeez Quest, didn't know you became such as Warrior fan - are you a bandwagoner now too? Chill out, give the champs some credit damn.
What I find funny is that people thinking that it actually matters (injuries, players playing or not playing, minutes, crowds cheering, blah, blah, blah) when they're just trying to come up with other things to talk about, and not giving The Raptors the proper respect they deserve.
The Raptors WON the NBA Title, the Warriors didn't lose it.
Comments
Gs bench isnt near the same as it was. Team was actually rather thin this season. It was their weakness this year.
Their playoffs starting lineup included what: Durant, Thompson, Curry, Green, and Cousins? That's not just a "big 3"...when that team clicked it was like NBA jam. What other teams in history were THIS stacked?
That still leaves Looney, Iggy, Livingston, Cook, and McKinnie...all solid contributors. C'mon that's a deep bench, Looney, Iggy, and Cook would probably be starters on other teams. I'm genuinely curious what other teams were stacked this high this year...Houston might have been close?
I'll give the Raptors credit for taking out a Giannis led Bucks team (that the League showed a blatantly obvious bias towards). Well done.
As for the Finals, nah. Minimal credit due. They faced a shell of a team trying to band-aid lineups together. And it STILL took them 6 games (would have been 7 if Steph hit that last shot).
Actually, it was really close to a sweep...had Iggy not made that 3 at the end of game 2 who knows.
I'll give the Raptors credit for taking out a Giannis led Bucks team (that the League showed a blatantly obvious bias towards). Well done.
As for the Finals, nah. Minimal credit due. They faced a shell of a team trying to band-aid lineups together. And it STILL took them 6 games (would have been 7 if Steph hit that last shot).
I was going to bring that up, but didnt want to sound like a butt hurt Dubs fan. Glad you said it!
Gs bench isnt near the same as it was. Team was actually rather thin this season. It was their weakness this year.
Their playoffs starting lineup included what: Durant, Thompson, Curry, Green, and Cousins? That's not just a "big 3"...when that team clicked it was like NBA jam. What other teams in history were THIS stacked?
That still leaves Looney, Iggy, Livingston, Cook, and McKinnie...all solid contributors. C'mon that's a deep bench, Looney, Iggy, and Cook would probably be starters on other teams. I'm genuinely curious what other teams were stacked this high this year...Houston might have been close?
Iguodala isnt near the same player. Livingston is done. Hes on the verge of retiring. Looney was hurt all series. Iggy was actually playing hurt as well. Cook is nothing. Mckinnie is just another player. Hes not special. Bell was overhyped basically barely playable. Jerebko is unplayable defender. Their bench is no longer deep. It was their weakness. This was discussed all playoffs. They had to find minutes due to injuries. You are thinking of iggy and livingston 2-3 years ago. They arent the same. Their bench got worse because of the starters they extended and signed.
Speaking of NBA if you have a Switch 2K19 is $1.99 on eShop.
Cheapomania!
Gs bench isnt near the same as it was. Team was actually rather thin this season. It was their weakness this year.
Their playoffs starting lineup included what: Durant, Thompson, Curry, Green, and Cousins? That's not just a "big 3"...when that team clicked it was like NBA jam. What other teams in history were THIS stacked?
That still leaves Looney, Iggy, Livingston, Cook, and McKinnie...all solid contributors. C'mon that's a deep bench, Looney, Iggy, and Cook would probably be starters on other teams. I'm genuinely curious what other teams were stacked this high this year...Houston might have been close?
Iguodala isnt near the same player. Livingston is done. Hes on the verge of retiring. Looney was hurt all series. Iggy was actually playing hurt as well. Cook is nothing. Mckinnie is just another player. Hes not special. Bell was overhyped basically barely playable. Jerebko is unplayable defender. Their bench is no longer deep. It was their weakness. This was discussed all playoffs. They had to find minutes due to injuries. You are thinking of iggy and livingston 2-3 years ago. They arent the same. Their bench got worse because of the starters they extended and signed.
Fair enough, I do think that Iggy could still start somewhere else though - while his stats might not show it, he makes plays happen and has a high basketball IQ. But then again I think he missed back to back free throws too last game lol. Looney is starter quality, and Cook will be if he isn't already.
I still don't hear any mentions of other teams that have a stronger roster though...
All I'm saying is that the Raptors earned it 100% and deserve the credit, considering the offseason moves they made and wow, what a year. Wish the Drake crap would take a backseat though. Now that free agency has taken a nosedive, I wonder if Kawhi will be tempted to dip out.
Gs bench isnt near the same as it was. Team was actually rather thin this season. It was their weakness this year.
Their playoffs starting lineup included what: Durant, Thompson, Curry, Green, and Cousins? That's not just a "big 3"...when that team clicked it was like NBA jam. What other teams in history were THIS stacked?
That still leaves Looney, Iggy, Livingston, Cook, and McKinnie...all solid contributors. C'mon that's a deep bench, Looney, Iggy, and Cook would probably be starters on other teams. I'm genuinely curious what other teams were stacked this high this year...Houston might have been close?
Iguodala isnt near the same player. Livingston is done. Hes on the verge of retiring. Looney was hurt all series. Iggy was actually playing hurt as well. Cook is nothing. Mckinnie is just another player. Hes not special. Bell was overhyped basically barely playable. Jerebko is unplayable defender. Their bench is no longer deep. It was their weakness. This was discussed all playoffs. They had to find minutes due to injuries. You are thinking of iggy and livingston 2-3 years ago. They arent the same. Their bench got worse because of the starters they extended and signed.
Fair enough, I do think that Iggy could still start somewhere else though - while his stats might not show it, he makes plays happen and has a high basketball IQ. But then again I think he missed back to back free throws too last game lol. Looney is starter quality, and Cook will be if he isn't already.
I still don't hear any mentions of other teams that have a stronger roster though...
All I'm saying is that the Raptors earned it 100% and deserve the credit, considering the offseason moves they made and wow, what a year. Wish the Drake crap would take a backseat though. Now that free agency has taken a nosedive, I wonder if Kawhi will be tempted to dip out.
Other teams dont have a stronger roster because no one has 5 freaking allstar starters.
Raptors deserve credit. But there is an asterisk to me. They beat a banged up warriors team. Just like the warriors got an asterisk when they beat the no love, kyrie cavs.
I also said originally if you look at this chain. Their bench was way thinner than in the past. And you came back at me with their starting 5. That wasnt what I was talking about
Gs bench isnt near the same as it was. Team was actually rather thin this season. It was their weakness this year.
Their playoffs starting lineup included what: Durant, Thompson, Curry, Green, and Cousins? That's not just a "big 3"...when that team clicked it was like NBA jam. What other teams in history were THIS stacked?
That still leaves Looney, Iggy, Livingston, Cook, and McKinnie...all solid contributors. C'mon that's a deep bench, Looney, Iggy, and Cook would probably be starters on other teams. I'm genuinely curious what other teams were stacked this high this year...Houston might have been close?
Iguodala isnt near the same player. Livingston is done. Hes on the verge of retiring. Looney was hurt all series. Iggy was actually playing hurt as well. Cook is nothing. Mckinnie is just another player. Hes not special. Bell was overhyped basically barely playable. Jerebko is unplayable defender. Their bench is no longer deep. It was their weakness. This was discussed all playoffs. They had to find minutes due to injuries. You are thinking of iggy and livingston 2-3 years ago. They arent the same. Their bench got worse because of the starters they extended and signed.
Iggy was playing lockdown defense all postseason and just hung 22 last night. I think he's still a stud player.
I'll give the Raptors credit for taking out a Giannis led Bucks team (that the League showed a blatantly obvious bias towards). Well done.
As for the Finals, nah. Minimal credit due. They faced a shell of a team trying to band-aid lineups together. And it STILL took them 6 games (would have been 7 if Steph hit that last shot).
I was going to bring that up, but didnt want to sound like a butt hurt Dubs fan. Glad you said it!
So I guess the warriors get minimal credit for beating basically just LeBron in 2015 and again in 2018?
Gs bench isnt near the same as it was. Team was actually rather thin this season. It was their weakness this year.
Their playoffs starting lineup included what: Durant, Thompson, Curry, Green, and Cousins? That's not just a "big 3"...when that team clicked it was like NBA jam. What other teams in history were THIS stacked?
That still leaves Looney, Iggy, Livingston, Cook, and McKinnie...all solid contributors. C'mon that's a deep bench, Looney, Iggy, and Cook would probably be starters on other teams. I'm genuinely curious what other teams were stacked this high this year...Houston might have been close?
Iguodala isnt near the same player. Livingston is done. Hes on the verge of retiring. Looney was hurt all series. Iggy was actually playing hurt as well. Cook is nothing. Mckinnie is just another player. Hes not special. Bell was overhyped basically barely playable. Jerebko is unplayable defender. Their bench is no longer deep. It was their weakness. This was discussed all playoffs. They had to find minutes due to injuries. You are thinking of iggy and livingston 2-3 years ago. They arent the same. Their bench got worse because of the starters they extended and signed.
Iggy was playing lockdown defense all postseason and just hung 22 last night. I think he's still a stud player.
If he had to play that much impact an entire season he wears down. They rest him a ton during the year. Hes old. Of course in an elimination game hes going all out. Again thats their best player off the bench. When they dont have their starter rotation, they are exposed. Cousins couldnt play big minutes. Klay missed 1.5 games. Durant played 12 minutes. Iguodala is a pretty good player. But hes also the best of their bench. After him there is no one really impactful.
I've been perusing this thread since the beginning and patiently watching, and waiting.... and waiting....
There was barely ANYBODY that gave The Raptors any respect, let alone to say they had a shot at winning it!
Hahaha.... NO ONE gave them any respect to get through The 6ers, or The Bucks. Nevermind get to the finals... or... WIN IT ALL!!!!
The Raptors played through adversity all year long with different line ups and roster changes and media questioning a first year coach and something strange called "load management". All the while they stayed consistent on the floor and the entire roster "bought in".
THE RAPTORS DESERVE RESPECT. They proved it all year, and it came to fruition with an NBA Championship.
Battled through adversity in EVERY round of the playoffs.
Wrote off after the first game against a hot Orlando Magic. They were done...
Back against the wall vs. Philly but they fought back and a shot that was bouncing on the rim for 18 years finally went down.
Down 2 games against the Bucks, it was going to be a SWEEP!!!! But Marc Gasol and other key players shut down Giannis and the Raps prevailed.
Then it was once again going to be a sweep against the Warriors. How could the mighty Warriors lose to a first time finals team???
Well.... IT HAPPENED. An even battle against a team that is a genuine dynasty. 3 titles in 5 years. 5 straight championship appearances, 2 championships in a row coming into 2019. Nick Nurse, the medical staff, and every player on the roster were able to come together to beat that team.
THE BETTER TEAM WON. Every series, and almost every game, a different person stepped up to help the Raps win.
CANADA IS THE NBA CHAMPION. That is an incredible thing. Canada is the NBA Champions....? However we want to butcher the english language.... RAPS ARE CHAMPS.
Now to the meaningless sideshow:
Achilles: KD should not have been playing, that's on the Warriors medical/management staff. Some raps fans were dicks (guy waving) yes, but it's not like buddy is thinking "Oh Kevin Durant is hurt, that is shitty for him" he's thinking "great, he's a really good player who won't be no the court anymore." Dick move, yes, but not malicious I wouldn't say. And literally 5s later the fans cheered KD off the court and chanted "KD". Just a media circus to distract from the fact that he shouldn't have been playing and the Warriors medical staff knew that. They said it was a "calf" but Leo Rautins, and others, said it was probably an achilles and he shouldn't return but he was getting pressure from the organization. Unfortunate, yes, but that's part of the game. It's not why the Raps won, or would have lost. Raps were banged up too. Lowry will have surgery this off season, and a lot of key bench players were out.
"Injuries": If anyone wants to bring up "injuries" as an argument for one team winning over the other, I will simply point out "load management". The Raptors literally managed how much load they were putting on Kawhi Leanard and specifically an injured thigh, and look what happened. He was able to play the majority of the regular season and dominate in the playoffs. Of course Thompson's injury was freak, but for KD, camman... there's no way he should have been on the court. Injuries happen both ways, it's not a reason this series was won by The Raptors)
Tell me that having two of the best three point shooters in the game surrrounded by All-Stars isn't good enough to beat the Raps? Had that been the case STILL no one would have given them a shot.
Either way, KD playing, Thompson playing, Lowry needing thumb surgery.... THE RAPTORS team beat The Warriors. They were the better team.
Even so, your statement that injuries played no role in the outcome is silly. The injuries to KD and Thompson absolutely impacted the way the series was played.
That said, I had no preference on who won. So congrats to the Raptors.
^ It's super easy to analyze everything after all is said and done.
Even so, your statement that injuries played no role in the outcome is silly. The injuries to KD and Thompson absolutely impacted the way the series was played.
That said, I had no preference on who won. So congrats to the Raptors.
I agree. It's silly and complete nonsense.
^ It's super easy to analyze everything after all is said and done.
Even so, your statement that injuries played no role in the outcome is silly. The injuries to KD and Thompson absolutely impacted the way the series was played.
That said, I had no preference on who won. So congrats to the Raptors.
I agree. It's silly and complete nonsense.
I could have easily made each of those main points about each series as they went on.
It's easy to say that injuries played a role in the outcome. Because the team you expected to win, lost. And one (then two) of their best players were injured. But you do realize that if KD played, they would have still have had to win 4 games, right? So, even after the Raps WIN a title, you're assuming they would have lost because of 1, then 2, players were not playing.
Doesn't matter who is on the court, you still need to play better as a team and win four games.
Does anybody talk about the fact that KD had to jump ship from his own team to join a winning team just to get a title? No one cares about that anymore.
Raps did it with a bunch of "nobodies" and still beat the Splash Brothers. Something that Lebron James and the Clevleand Cavaliers couldn't do in 2016. So you can make these arguments either way. Warriors have the two best three opint shooters in the NBA, Curry is on pace to be the greatest ever both in % and 3's made, Draymond Green, Igoudala, and Cousins..... so that's not enough?
If someone said "Can the Raps beat the Warriors without KD?" you'd have said no, EVERYONE on these boards said Raps didn't stand a chance! Haha...
Fact is, Raptors could have won if the Warriors did or didn't have KD. Injuries are a part of the game. They should have had better bench players then. That's on the GM.
Making the argument that team X only won because team Y had injuries is what's silly. There's been years where the Warrriors won when players on the other teams were injured..... sssssooooo.... is anyone taking away from those victories?
Raps won. Not Lowry, not Leanard.... KD didn't lose, Curry didn't lose. RAPTORS WON, AND WARRIORS LOST.
Simple.
Edit:
And no one is talking about Raps injuries.... Lowry's thumb is damn near falling off and Kawhi is limping around. Van Vleet got his face smashed in. Again, bench mob was hurt/out for the playoffs.
Houston didnt take advantage of no durant. I was dissapointed. Toronto got a few more gifts and took advantage. Did exactly what they were supposed to do. Toronto has a good team.
You think Id give a damn if the Rockets beat Golden States D League if it was all thats left. Id take it and celebrate. All we are saying is they lost 2 gigantic pieces and the rest were hobbled like a few raptors might have been. It played a role. Especially with all the close played games. One of the best shooters on the planet and arguably the best player on the planet didnt play. It matters.
Dude take the win and chill
Houston didnt take advantage of no durant. I was dissapointed. Toronto got a few more gifts and took advantage. Did exactly what they were supposed to do. Toronto has a good team.
You think Id give a damn if the Rockets beat Golden States D League was all thats left. Id take it and celebrate. All we are saying is they lost 2 gigantic pieces and the rest were hobbled like a few raptors might have been. It played a role. Especially with all the close played games. One of the best shooters on the planet and arguably the best player on the planet didnt play. It matters.
I am chill.
Actually.... it doesn't matter. Toronto Raptors are your 2019 NBA Champions. That's what matters.
What I find funny is that people thinking that it actually matters (injuries, players playing or not playing, minutes, crowds cheering, blah, blah, blah) when they're just trying to come up with other things to talk about, and not giving The Raptors the proper respect they deserve.
The Raptors WON the NBA Title, the Warriors didn't lose it.
You need to chill and give The Raptors the proper respect they deserve.
GS's been to the Finals 5 years in a row, everyone shat on them when Durant joined yet now.... god forbid the Raps beat the mighty warriors, haha.
GS won without him (KD) and won with him. It can be done both ways. GS also won NBA titles while other players were injured, it happens both ways. That's why arguing one way or the other is pointless.
Raps won this series. That's it.
Edit: This is exactly why I didn't get involved in this thread during the playoffs.
I didn't want to waste my energy on this stupid shit.
Imagine me having to sit here and say "Just wait... down 2-0 to the Bucks, got to take it one game at a time." Haha... it would be hell on earth having to deal with this.
But alas... The Raptors prevail.
Major respect to all the other teams. It wasn't easy for the Raptors. Beating the defending champs (no matter what) is no small task.
Trying to act like the injuries made no difference is crazy.
Drake is a clown too, doing post game interviews and shit. Straight up grown male cheerleader. Cant wait to see his raptors tattoo.
And at Americansteam7-
Yes, their wins againts the cavs with no love and kyrie is the same level.
In the end a championship is a championship. Canada can enjoy their trophy, their teams never win anything else.
Dude take the win and chill
Houston didnt take advantage of no durant. I was dissapointed. Toronto got a few more gifts and took advantage. Did exactly what they were supposed to do. Toronto has a good team.
You think Id give a damn if the Rockets beat Golden States D League was all thats left. Id take it and celebrate. All we are saying is they lost 2 gigantic pieces and the rest were hobbled like a few raptors might have been. It played a role. Especially with all the close played games. One of the best shooters on the planet and arguably the best player on the planet didnt play. It matters.
I am chill.
Actually.... it doesn't matter. Toronto Raptors are your 2019 NBA Champions. That's what matters.
What I find funny is that people thinking that it actually matters (injuries, players playing or not playing, minutes, crowds cheering, blah, blah, blah) when they're just trying to come up with other things to talk about, and not giving The Raptors the proper respect they deserve.
The Raptors WON the NBA Title, the Warriors didn't lose it.
You need to chill and give The Raptors the proper respect they deserve.
GS's been to the Finals 5 years in a row, everyone shat on them when Durant joined yet now.... god forbid the Raps beat the mighty warriors, haha.
GS won without him (KD) and won with him. It can be done both ways. GS also won NBA titles while other players were injured, it happens both ways. That's why arguing one way or the other is pointless.
Raps won this series. That's it.
Edit: This is exactly why I didn't get involved in this thread during the playoffs.
I didn't want to waste my energy on this stupid shit.
Imagine me having to sit here and say "Just wait... down 2-0 to the Bucks, got to take it one game at a time." Haha... it would be hell on earth having to deal with this.
But alas... The Raptors prevail.
Major respect to all the other teams. It wasn't easy for the Raptors. Beating the defending champs (no matter what) is no small task.
I guess you dont want to actually reading anything I said. I even said just like when the warriors beat the cavs without love or kyrie.
I said the raptors are a good team and did what they were supposed to do.
What do you want us to say? BOW DOWN TO THE MIGHTY RAPTORS. Jesus, I hate the warriors with a passion, but cmon man.
The biggest loser in this series is by far boogie, who probably lost at least $25 million this year to get carried to a ring and got nothing.
RIP.
Toronto straight outplayed GS and took the championship. The only blemish for Toronto was game 5.
GS got outplayed, out willed even out coached. Everything else is just X factors and that's the way shit goes.
Toronto 2019 NBA champs no ifs ands or buts.
That is some straight bandwagon shit lol. I was wondering who the first to show up was gonna be.
Trying to act like the injuries made no difference is crazy.
Drake is a clown too, doing post game interviews and shit. Straight up grown male cheerleader. Cant wait to see his raptors tattoo.
And at Americansteam7-
Yes, their wins againts the cavs with no love and kyrie is the same level.
In the end a championship is a championship. Canada can enjoy their trophy, their teams never win anything else.
Hahaha, bandwagon.... Dude, I've been watching The Raptors since I was 12 (Grew up in Ontario). Been to many games at the (then) ACC, saw them in Edmonton when I lived in Alberta, and got a shout-out from Chuck Swirsky on a live game ~10 years ago... bandwagon, haha...
And I'm stoked for all the people who DID jump on the bandwagon. Almost 1/2 of Canada watched the final game at some point. I'm okay with that.
To Quest, and everyone, I'd like to make something clear:
You are 100% correct that adding/subracting a player would "make a difference" to a game. However, my point is that saying injuries makes a difference is:
1) A weak argument because of how simple it is to say "a player would make a difference" and that you could literally say it about any player and you would be right simply by the definition of "difference".
2) It disregards a teams gameplay and assumes the other team (with the injuries) would have won. Which, isn't true. Both teams still would have needed to win 4 no matter who is on the court.
I think it's the same without Kyrie or Love. Warrriors won, end of story, there are no asterisks, they were the better team.... and the reason for that is because it's not Kyrie, Love, or KD that win a title... it's the team. One player can't win a game in basketball. So saying "it would have made a difference" is a poor argument because there are so many variables. It's the organization's job to get their players into the playoffs healthy.
Hahaha, is that last one supposed to be a dig? Who cares? USA has 10x the population, and in most sports Canada only has a couple teams.
NHL 6-30 something teams? MLB 1- I have no idea how many teams, NFL - 0, NBA - 1-30 teams....???
Of course, the NBA only has one Canadian team. The Raptors. Not sure if you knew that.
That would leave odds in favour of the American teams. Prettty simple, haha. Plus... we do okay at the Winter Olympics!
I guess you dont want to actually reading anything I said. I even said just like when the warriors beat the cavs without love or kyrie.
I said the raptors are a good team and did what they were supposed to do.
What do you want us to say? BOW DOWN TO THE MIGHTY RAPTORS. Jesus, I hate the warriors with a passion, but cmon man.
Yeah, so The Raps get an asterisk *KD was hurt? Haha, that sucks...
Yes
GS lost to 1 top guy and a bunch of role players, Kevin Durant aside they still had Curry, Green and Thomson (for the most part) and an older Igudala with a some what game Cousins. Still a had them shooters. People need to stop being salty and give credit where credit is due.
GS lost all of there home games. Two of them they just got outplayed, the third Klay went down. They were down KD yes, even so GS still has the better roster.
Toronto straight outplayed GS and took the championship. The only blemish for Toronto was game 5.
GS got outplayed, out willed even out coached. Everything else is just X factors and that's the way shit goes.
Toronto 2019 NBA champs no ifs ands or buts.
All of this. Roll this all up into one big sentence and you got the truth.
Skinny nailed it.
Other teams dont have a stronger roster because no one has 5 freaking allstar starters.
Raptors deserve credit. But there is an asterisk to me. They beat a banged up warriors team. Just like the warriors got an asterisk when they beat the no love, kyrie cavs.
I also said originally if you look at this chain. Their bench was way thinner than in the past. And you came back at me with their starting 5. That wasnt what I was talking about
For someone that literally just talked shit in this thread that other people didn't read what you typed...you clearly didn't read that I listed their starting 5 AND 5 solid contributors from the bench. Three of which I feel are starter quality.
Jeez Quest, didn't know you became such as Warrior fan - are you a bandwagoner now too? Chill out, give the champs some credit damn.
What I find funny is that people thinking that it actually matters (injuries, players playing or not playing, minutes, crowds cheering, blah, blah, blah) when they're just trying to come up with other things to talk about, and not giving The Raptors the proper respect they deserve.
The Raptors WON the NBA Title, the Warriors didn't lose it.
Truth brother, nice post.