NES Artifacts in some games... How can I get rid of them?

NintendopeNintendope
in Help Wanted!
I have some games the display artifacts when playing them.Namely Megaman 2, Super Mario Bros 3 and the original SMB. I've cleaned the games really well with one of those cleaning kits you can get off amazon or any other niche nintendo dealer so they're perfectly clean. The 72 pin connector is brand new. I've seen this before a bunch of times but Google comes up with zero results relating to this problem.

Check out the pic. The floating treetops on the left is what I'm talking about.

Any ideas?

EDIT: Pay no attention to the color banding of the pic. it's just the iphone camera.

Comments

  • StanStan
    What in the... I'm no expect, but I'm going to guess something is actually wrong somewhere deep in the circuits of those games. Have you tried other copies just to check to see if it's something weird about the system you're using?
  • NintendopeNintendope
    Originally posted by: Stan

    What in the... I'm no expect, but I'm going to guess something is actually wrong somewhere deep in the circuits of those games. Have you tried other copies just to check to see if it's something weird about the system you're using?


    No I don't have another NES to test it on. =(
  • StanStan
    No, I mean is this consistent with other games or ONLY those games? If those games, you should pick up a cheap copy of one of them and see if you get the same result. Sounds like it's most likely the NES itself, you might have a loose diode or something in there that you might be able to resolder, or perhaps a new 72-pin connector would do the trick. Did you try opening it up and physically bending out the pins so it works a little better? That might work.
  • removed04092017removed04092017
    You mean around the characters? That's probably a TV problem. Try also the alternate method of video input if you can. If you're on RF that may fix it. If you're talking about the stuff in the middle left, I think that you might have a broken something, can you get a MM screenshot and see what that looks like? Very weird problem.
  • EnslavedEnslaved
    That's definitely a problem with your NES, I would try to change out the 72 pin, and if that doesn't work, checking out connections on the motherboard itself.
  • NESHomebrewNESHomebrew
    Looks like a connection problem. You said you put a new 72 pin connector in. I'd try removing it and putting it in again making sure it is making a solid connection.
  • NintendopeNintendope
    It occurs on both of my SMB 3 carts. Here's another pic for reference...

    The 72 pin connector is brand new and fires up games just fine. Yes it's only on certain games I believe. I haven't thoroughly gone through my titles but in these games, it shows up just fine in certain areas. The 72 pin was put in there very tightly.

    These artifacts don't show up all the time,  but when it does... it's very annoying and confusing since they look like part of the sprites in the game.

    It's running on composite output btw.

    I'm guessing it's the NES but I wouldn't have a clue as to how I should diagnose it.
  • removed04092017removed04092017
    If you exit the screen and come back, are they still there? Very weird problem!
  • Thundercat08Thundercat08
    Might sounds like a silly question but after you cleaned the games and put them in the NES with the new pin how long did you let the games dry? It's possible that the games were still damp and touched the new pin therefore making the pin bad? I really have no idea just a thought. I had this happen once with a game (Big Nose Freaks Out), I put in the game after it was cleaned and dry for a couple days and it did that on my system, I got rid of the game and the system and never looked back.
  • HerbalistHerbalist
    Did you clean off the area you plug the 72-pin into? Just because its a new connector doesnt mean it wont have a shitty connection if the motherbaord itself is grimey.

    Also, game cleaning kits work for shit so i wouldnt be so sure they are 100% clean. Buy a gamebit for $4 and open those bitches up. Give em a nice rub n' tug with some weimans.
  • NintendopeNintendope
    Herbalist: Yes I cleaned that as well. The cleaning kits are basically brass cleaner so it gets the contacts super shiny and look brand spanking new.

    Thundercat08: Yes I let them dry. In fact, the second SMB3 cart I tried I didn't clean at all so it was dirty.

    3GenGames: Not sure what you mean by exiting the screen. Pausing will not "overwrite" that area (as in- it won't turn the screen a different color like in zelda1).



    Remember this happens with both carts so I'm assuming it's a problem with my mobo. =\
  • Thundercat08Thundercat08
    Where did you get the term Artifact from?
  • HerbalistHerbalist
    Originally posted by: Thundercat08

    Where did you get the term Artifact from?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visual_artifact

  • Thundercat08Thundercat08
    ahh thanks

  • Thundercat08Thundercat08
    found this talks about the The NES Picture Processing Unit (PPU)

    r-floppy&Itemid=7">http://badderhacksnet.ipage.com/badderhacks/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=270:the-nes-picture-processing-unit-ppu&catid=14r-floppy&Itemid=7
  • ne$_pimpne$_pimp
    Can you hear a micro chip shaking around inside the game? Or was the game cover with dirt or some type of shit before you cleaned it.
  • removed04092017removed04092017
    Originally posted by: Nintendope

    it's a problem with my mobo. =\


    Probably, clones suck, even if it's not usually THAT bad, but doesn't surprise me if you're using a clone...Also, I mean like leave the screen like go to the middle of the level from where SMB3's shows up, then go back. Is it still there?

    And I don't think this is a cart problem either, it happens with multiple games and also if was a connector problem, the game would have crashed or all the graphics would have been trashed.
  • NintendopeNintendope
    Originally posted by: 3GenGames

    Originally posted by: Nintendope

    it's a problem with my mobo. =\


    Probably, clones suck, even if it's not usually THAT bad, but doesn't surprise me if you're using a clone...Also, I mean like leave the screen like go to the middle of the level from where SMB3's shows up, then go back. Is it still there?

    And I don't think this is a cart problem either, it happens with multiple games and also if was a connector problem, the game would have crashed or all the graphics would have been trashed.

    It's the original NES I've had since 86/87 so maybe it's just run it's course.

    Yeah those artifacts are still present...

  • NintendopeNintendope
    Originally posted by: nes_pimp

    Can you hear a micro chip shaking around inside the game? Or was the game cover with dirt or some type of shit before you cleaned it.


    Nope. I opened up the games with the security bit to clean em (well one of the smb's) so I'm going to pop open the motherboard and see what I see... otherwise, I'm in the market for a brand new used toaster!
  • removed04092017removed04092017
    They're still present but still don't show up anywhere else? Wow, that's....I take my statement back, that may be a program character problem, but I still would be shocked if it was the carts. Are you using all official equipment?
  • BouncekDeLemosBouncekDeLemos
    I get this too:



    image


    image



    I'm running a FC Twin with V/A cables. I can't remember if this did that on my Sega or original NES or not, I'll have to check. I don't think it's the games, just the system when it's hooked up to my Polaroid HD TV. Although, I don't get this problem with old CRT type TVs.

    Also, Splatterhouse Wanpaku Graffiti messes up on the 2nd level on a FC Twin... so fair warning. That's a topic for some other time tho.
  • NintendopeNintendope
    Originally posted by: BouncekDeLemos

    I get this too:



    image


    image



    I'm running a FC Twin with V/A cables. I can't remember if this did that on my Sega or original NES or not, I'll have to check. I don't think it's the games, just the system when it's hooked up to my Polaroid HD TV. Although, I don't get this problem with old CRT type TVs.

    Also, Splatterhouse Wanpaku Graffiti messes up on the 2nd level on a FC Twin... so fair warning. That's a topic for some other time tho.


    Real interesting. Anybody else get this? I would love to know so I could either get another NES or not.


    As an update..... It seems to occur on basically all my games but to varying degrees. I can't recall if it did this originally on my NES or not. I do remember how when scrolling, the NES would have corrupt tiles on the side of the screen (See SMB3). It was tough to notice on the old crt tvs though because of the dead space on the sides that you normally couldn't see because of the tube.
  • removed04092017removed04092017
    Only SMB3 mainly, as it was avoidable by better programming and cutting off the left side to make it less noticeable, it's not a disablity of the games, just not having extra RAM and bad programmers on a time crunch.



    As for these new artifacts, I've never seen these before. Surely it's not the system, very very weird.
  • BouncekDeLemosBouncekDeLemos
    I think I may have figured it out. Take a look at these pics I took. NES on top, FC Twin on the bottom. (Ignore the NES's glitchiness, that was from my non-refurbished NES, my good one is in storage)



    image



    Since I'm getting the same exact problem with official hardware, it's not the system. I tried this with many different carts too so it's not the games either.



    That leaves us with one thing: It's our televisions. I thought about it some, and I might need some conformation on this, but it seems to be a slight video layer signal with overscan. It's not full video overscan, but a part of it's signal. Artifacts are caused by video signal.


    It's simple to see why the artifacts are in that particular spot too. Take the artifact of Mario in my pics, go left a little until you reach the end of what you think the artifacts screen ends (compare it to the actual sprite), and from there to the end of the official's sprite screen going left, is the actual rez of the systems video. It's because we're stretching it is what's causing the signal to go like that casing the artifacts. It's just the output trying to maintain the screens small rez on something with a larger rez screen (like a HDTV)
    Your TV is shooting the signal the other direction or in a different spot, but the results are the same.


    That's why we won't get this on a normal CRT TV. :3 Some HDTV's may have better video hardware that allows a better stretch scan than other HDTVs. Not that there's anything wrong with anything, it's just that we're pushing old hardware on newer TVs.
  • HerbalistHerbalist
    It looks like you have the game stretched to widescreen 16:9 ratio. NES games wont work proper unless boxed sqUARE TO 4:3.Does your TV have a "game" mode that puts bars on the L+R so its square?

    Running a game in widescreen royally messes with its timing.
  • ZingZing
    It could be related to the 240p signal of the NES. Have you tried other 240p systems (SNES, PlayStation)?


    Someone, either here or on Digital Press forums, had a Polaroid HDTV that didn't work properly with 240p. I don't recall the user name.
  • removed04092017removed04092017
    Weird, as it really shouldn't unless your TV doesn't support the NES's output. Especially since stuff like that probably preprocesses the picture. Speaking of that, does switching to/from game mode fix it?
  • NESHomebrewNESHomebrew
    Have you tried reseating the 72-pin connector. Sometimes that is all it takes. No matter how clean it is, if it isn't seated properly on the contacts you could get graphic corruption.
  • BouncekDeLemosBouncekDeLemos
    I don't have a game-mode on my Television since it's a Polaroid HDTV (?)... I've switched all through the modes and every one has this proplem. All the modes on my TV do is adjust the color, tint, brightness, etc. It has nothing to do with the signal and does not give me a boxed-in option (Either that, or I can't find it).

    Strangely enough, no other system does this but my NES. If I play PS2, Dreamcast, 3DO-- everything's good with no artifacts.

    If anyone has this problem and can adjust the screen to a smaller rez, let me know if you get the artifacts or not.

Sign In or Register to comment.